I think a lot of cycling reviews really let the reader down. They describe a lot of technical details (often taken at face value from the manufacturer without any independent verification) and rarely offer a concrete insight on whether the bike is really worth a buy or not. Likewise I find a lot of first impressions on forums to be a little too broad/shallow in their description, or they fixate on very nuanced or specific topics that would not be relevant to the average buyer. So I am writing this in hopes that it will help at least be a more useful resource for folks considering this particular bike.
Background: I am by no means a “fast” cyclist. I am 29 years old, 6 feet, about 160lbs and have an FTP of 260W on a good day. I’ve been cycling since I was 17, dabbled in triathlon when I was in college, and now am cycling recreationally with the hope of being able to do some-kind of fondo, or epic bike ride within the next year or so (whenever COVID calms down).
I bought my Cervelo S5 simply because the carbon fiber roadbike I bought in high-school is getting a little long in the tooth. I really love the bike and have the fit 100% dialed in. But it’s beginning to creek and rattle quite a bit, I’ve moved to a hilly area and feel like disc brakes would be a better safety feature to investigate, and I’ve always had the goal of getting a really nice bike for myself so I figured now’s the time to do so!
Other Bikes Considered:
When I began this search a huge range of bikes were considered. I had a roughly $6K pricepoint, but didn’t mine splurging if I found the right bike. Cable integration and electronic shifting were a must. I also wanted to buy something that would ultimately put a smile on my face for a long time.
Knowing that this bike will likely need to last me another 10+ years I was very much looking into more traditional roadbikes and endurance bikes from a longterm comfort and accessibility perspective.
The Fezzarri Empire SL was actually at the top of this list with wireless shifting, integrated cabling, and a pretty clever frame design really calling to me for about $4K all in. But when COVID hit they had a 6-month lead time on bikes and that just didn’t work for me.
Canyon’s Endurace and Ultimate were pretty compelling but they felt long in the tooth with their exposed cabling.
I also considered BMC’s line of roadbikes but couldn’t find one that really “spoke” to me.
I looked through a lot of other brands: Cannondale, Trek, Cube, Ribble, Orbea, Giant, Argon, Look, Ridley, Scott, Focus, and a half dozen other boutique brands that I can’t quite recall. All had some options, but nothing that really hit the nail on the head.
I then decided to focus more exclusively on aerobikes. Primarly because I think aerobikes look really cool! The main contenders were the S5, 2021 Canyon Aeroad, BMC Time Machine Road, Specialized Venge, Quintana Roo SRFive and Specialized Tarmac SL-7 (which I know technically isn’t a pure Aerobike!).
The Aeroad was quickly ruled out due to availability, and I honestly wanted a wide flat aerobar.
The BMC Time Machine Road had availability issues, and while the integration it has is really cool, I wasn’t going gaga for the way it looked. Reviewers also said it was perhaps the least “Aero” feeling Aero bike in the sense that it was “fast” but not in a way that was super obvious.
The Venge was tempting since it’s one of the “Ultimate” bikes you can get. But I had a hard time tracking one down at a price and color combo that felt right. For how impressive the Venge is I do see a lot of them around me…so it felt perhaps a bit less “special” in some ways.
The Quintana Roo SRFive was high on the list due to the fact that it came with great wheelset options, customizable colors, and Quintana Roo is pretty flexible with adding specific componentry for you. However, something about the proportions felt a little off to me, and their aero claims felt a little less substantiated to me. They
To be honest the Tarmac SL-7 felt like the perfect bike for me. Roadbike in design, but very aero design cues. However, it’s a pricey bike, availability was nonexistent, and honestly the color combos available at the more “affordable” pricepoints felt pretty garbage. It’s a nice bike! But not worth spending exuberant amounts of money over.
I happened across a really well maintained S5 on an old triathlon forum I used to frequent that was priced really fairly (around $6200) and I jumped on the opportunity!
The Specs: The bike I purchased came with the following: -2019 S5 Disc black/gray -Size 56CM -Ultrega Di2 -62MM DT Swiss Arc 1450 Wheels -Garmin Vector 2 Pedals You can check it out here: https://postimg.cc/gallery/PfxQhtH
Design & Build Quality: I absolutely love the way this bike looks. The handlebar looks so aggressive & unique, while the frame profiles feel sleek. It honestly reminds me of being the “Lamborghini” of bikes…it’s just such a departure from what we’re used to seeing, and feels so abundantly functional, yet “loud” at the same time. I seriously sneak a look at the bike every time I go into the garage…having a bike that makes me want to do that is almost worth the price of admission alone.
I also think black is the perfect color for this bike. It feels so classically Cervelo and almost gives the bike a “stealth fighter” feel. Perhaps a small downside of the black paint job is that it tends to show small scratches and imperfections more readily, but the overall package feels so bold that you don’t necessarily mind it. Also in a lot of circumstances a quick wipe down will help to hide or correct whatever imperfections you may see.
What I will say is the current colors for the mid-range S5 models are pretty garbage. There’s a gray+black combo and a chameleon blue. The gray+black feels too plain for this bike while chameleon blue only works if you want something really bold. I really wish manufacturers would just always offer a classy “base” color while giving you a couple of different options each model year. Right now the current trend is pretty much polarizing/crappy colors at the lower levels and super nice color schemes at the higher levels, which is rather annoying to me.
While I haven’t had the bike for a long time it feels really well built. I remember touching and feeling a Trek Madone not too long ago and everything felt very hollow, cheap, and flimsy to me. The handle bar on this bike feels very “solid” and “stiff” to touch, and the frame as a whole just feels nice to hold in hand.
Aside from the cool handlebar and sleek aero profiles there’s not tons to call-out on this bike design-wise, no special storage integration, extra fancy seatpost/suspension system, etc. It’s kind of a no frills bike in that regard but it honestly feels so well built and just “cool” to look at that you don’t really feel like you’re missing out by not having these things.
The only thing that would have been cool would have been some kind of clever solution to hide your flat kit+tools. But that’s only because the lines are so clean on this bike that it feels like a sin to put a saddlebag on it.
There is the fork-steerer tube design flaw that was called out YouTube. For a lot of people this is a big miss and a big issue. While I haven’t had tons of saddle time on this bike, I’m not immensely worried about it at the moment.
Performance: Does this bike feel fast to ride? Yes! Here are the differences I noticed compared to a fairly standard road frame from 10 years ago & compared to an old Cervelo P2SL triathlon bike I used to ride.
First off this bike feels really stiff. Not stiff in a jarring, you can’t be comfortable way, but stiff in the sense that you really feel like your pedal strokes are putting power to the ground. This makes the bike feel really dialed in, almost aggressive in nature. You’re not “dancing on the pedals” when you’re on this bike you’re more of a heat-seeking missile. Compared to the other bikes I’ve ridden…I don’t think I’ve actually felt a lack of stiffness that I could properly call out, so I find descriptions of stiffness to be a little hard to quantify. I’d best sum it up as with this bike every ounce of energy pushes you forward, and you don’t quite realize that your current bike isn’t doing that for you until you ride something that is stiffer.
I was very curious about the aero properties of this bike. I used to ride a Cervelo P2SL when I did triathlons…which though dated is still a fairly fast frame. I remember consistently being a few miles per hour faster on that bike. For instance 20mph would feel like a decent amount of effort on my old road bike, whereas I could hold 22mph on the P2SL no problem.
What’s really noticeable with this bike is as you are accelerating you just don’t feel the wind drag hit you as hard as you would normally expect. For instance I typically start to notice drag really hit around 20mph and it becomes fairly substantial at 25mph+. On this bike when you hit 20mph it doesn’t feel like anything is wanting to slow it down, it’s kind of interesting! From a purely “feel perspective” it basically feels as fast as the P2SL I used to ride just without the aerobar position helping me get more aero.
I also feel like the handling on this bike is very responsive. I really don’t have a good benchmark for this (aside from my old roadbike) but I’d say as you lean or steer to change direction you feel the bike immediately start to grab that line. With my old roadbike it would change directions well but would feel maybe a little “floaty” in comparison. There’s just a noticeable increase in precision on this bike.
My first ride out with this bike was on a local 25 mile loop with about 1200’ of climbing. I usually average 16-16.5mph on this loop and on the S5 I was averaging 18.5mph with plenty left in the tank if I wanted to push it more. The next day I took the bike on another local loop as a recovery ride basically trying to keep the heart rate around 140mph, and I apparently set a PR on the loop despite not really pushing myself in any particular way. So the speed gains are pretty apparent to me. It’s not going to make you a hero…but I think if you’re coming from something old and non-aero 1.5-2mph is what you can count on and you will notice it.
I am not sure if it’s the bottom bracket, the components, the geometry of the bike, or what exactly but I find it very easy to achieve a smooth pedal stroke and a high cadence on this bike even in higher gears. On my old roadbike, if I was in the big chain-ring I’d have to be in easier gears in the back to keep my cadence high, and I’d often just be in the smaller ring to make it easier to accelerate off of stoplights, etc. On this bike it is almost no problem being in the big chainring the whole time even when going uphill on sections that I’d typical use the small chain-ring on.
Now what I will say is for all of the positives I just listed above, this bike will not make you fast. Yes I definitely notice the differences and advantages that this frame offers, but I also don’t think if I was out of shape that I’d find this bike to be a huge step up over a normal roadbike. If anything, this bike is so focused on making you go fast that you might prematurely “blow-up” a little bit if riding it out of shape. You’d think you could hold 20mph until all of the sudden you couldn’t. Whereas on a normal roadbike you would find it easier to put around at a pace more in line with your current fitness.
Likewise towards the end of a 40 mile ride I was starting to run out of gas, putting around at 14mph and I felt no faster or no better than I would on my old roadbike in such a situation. So when you’re feeling good and pushing hard, you’re going to feel this bike help you, but when you’re having an off day or not quite putting the power down anymore this bike isn’t going to do much to rescue you. So I’d say this bike is best enjoyed when you’re somewhat fit or in shape.
Geometry+Ride Comfort:
I was actually really worried about the geometry of this bike. I remember seeing one on the trail one-day and noticing that the rider was riding really long and low on the frame. However I also cross-referenced its frame geometry with a bunch of other bikes and it was only a few mm off in stack+reach and other measurements. So in other words, perhaps not as dramatic of a departure as I thought.
The head-tube feels really long on this bike and it barely angles up. Compared to my 56cm roadbike the Cervelo S5 is noticeably longer and significantly lower. Crucially however, despite how aggressive this position looks once you’re in the saddle and reaching for the handlebar you realize that it’s not an unobtainable position to be in.
Yes you’re reaching a bit more, yes you are lower, but you also feel like you are in a more powerful position and that you have more control over the bike because you have a lower center of gravity. Sometimes being in a tight sportscar is more comfortable than being in a loose sedan and I’d say that feels to be the case here.
The handlebars are very comfortable to touch and interact with. The flat aero tops are awesome to put your hands on and wrap your fingers around, while the hoods and drops feel very natural to get to.
My bike is equipped with 28mm tubeless tires and everything feels very “smooth” when riding. I am sure this is mostly the wheel+tire combo, but between that and the frame I have no complaints on road harshness by any means. You’re definitely not floating around on a cloud, but it’s not like I’m saying to myself “man I wish this bike was less harsh”
In general if you’re worried about comfort on this bike from a geometry perspective or road-harshness perspective I’m confident you’ll be able to make this bike work unless you have some very specific needs.
Weight: While I don’t have a scale for this bike, most reports peg this as being in the high 16.9ish-17.6ish lb range depending on size and components. I’d say that feels about right.
The bike certainly does not feel like a featherweight, but it’s by no means overly dense or a complete tank to ride. What I’ve noticed with disc brake bikes is the weight feels very heavily concentrated towards the wheels/bottom of the bike. This can make the bike feel heavier than it is because the balance can be a little odd. Likewise, when lifting the S5 you have to almost hold the top tube 80% back for it to feel balanced in your hand, and the point of balance is a very a short range to find. I don’t think this actually matters in any serious capacity, just something interesting to note comparing the other bikes I’ve interacted with. The fact that it’s kind of hard to balance the bike in hand can make it feel like it weighs more than it does, but when you do bike it up balanced you go “hmm it’s actually lighter than I remember”
I took this bike up some of my local hills and felt no noticeable weight consequence. If anything, the stiffness and aero properties on this bike are so prevalent, even going uphill, that I would take them any day of the week versus this bike losing a couple of extra lbs.
Di2: When I first started looking for bikes I was 100% for a SRAM Force AXS groupset. My current roadbike has a SRAM Rival groupset, which I love, and to me the extra gear range and the wireless technology behind SRAM Force AXS made a lot of sense to me. However, with SRAM Force AXS being pretty new my bike options were somewhat limited in availability, whereas Ultrega Di2 was much more ubiquitous to come across. Obviously…stumbling across this bike with as good of a deal as I was getting I figured it wasn’t worth holding out for SRAM Force any longer than I had to.
Here’s what got me to go with Ultrega Di2: -The hood buttons being able to switch pages on a head-unit seemed really cool. -The fact that you could change shifting profiles with the PC app and USB cable in case you didn’t spring for the wireless d-fly module. -The fact that I could basically set it up to shift like SRAM Force AXS would (with the exception of the L+R simultaneous press to change from big ring to small) if I really wanted to.
My first ride with Ultrega Di2 was actually pretty disappointing. When I got my bike the battery was completely dead. I plugged it in and it immediately came to life, and I decided to let the bike charge overnight.
After getting a full charge on the battery I unplugged the bike for a few days, as the battery is supposed to last several months depending on shift style. Upon finally deciding to take the bike on its first “proper” ride at 6:00am in the morning, I clip in, go down the driveway, turn onto the main street and my shifters are completely dead. I do a quick 1.3 mile loop around the block, of course stuck in a pretty hard gear, and decided to hop on Zwift instead while the battery charged.
So the fact that the battery can completely die with no real way to save it or resurrect things mid-ride is a bit of a bummer. But I also would say that it was a bit of operator error on my end, as I must have done something to let the battery drain over night.
Now for my first actual ride, Di2 is pretty amazing. I tend to keep my mechanical derailleurs pretty well sorted, but shifting can be a bit of a hassle. If you’re on a climb or not really in the right cadence (for whatever reason) you just hear and feel the derailleurs forcing themselves into gear and it feels very abrupt. Likewise, on longer distance rides, it’s honestly not uncommon for your fingers and hands to get a little tired which just adds to some of the mental anguish you may be feeling 80 miles into your ride!
Di2 is just a quick click and you’re in the gear you selected. No drama, no fuss. You want to switch between chain-rings, no problem! Everything about using it is easier and better and I honestly feel like it makes you a safer rider. When coming to a stop-light I’d sometimes not always be able to downshift as much as I’d like, which would make starting up again a slightly hairy process. That’s just not an issue at all anymore with Di2. You can jump down 5 gears in a few seconds and with minimal abruptness or huge shocks to the driveline so to speak.
Likewise I’d often find myself mentally staying in gear at less ideal cadences just because mechanical shifting could be a little abrupt or require some effort that could take my focus away from the road. Now I find myself just naturally honing in at a good geacadence for myself because it takes no effort to do so.
The front derailleur also makes a pretty badass sound when you use it. It’s an electronic servo whine, but it mentally feels like a turbo-blow off valve going off or hearing a sick supercharger whine on your car. The shift buttons also have a very satisfying range of travel and “click” to them. All in all, though you do lose some of the clanks and sensations that make mechanical shifting feel so tactile, you have other ways to engage the sense with Di2 which makes for a pretty fun and gratifying experience using the shifters.
What I probably like about Di2 the most is it feels like the derailleurs work in tandem to minimize friction. This leads to just a silky smooth shifting and pedaling experience that feels really sublime to interact with.
I’d say the build quality on Ultrega Di2 is very high. All of the contact points feel very “solid” and you generally get the impression that you’re interacting with a very well built, very precise piece of hardware.
I was personally worried about the shifting controls being a little annoying. I’m a SRAM guy and I actually don’t like the way Shimano’s mechanical groupsets shift, but within 5 minutes I got used to Shimano’s dual button layout and I don’t find it to be a problem to interact with at all.
Now for the negatives, I do think it’s kind of BS that you need to spend $100-$150 for a wireless module to talk to your cycling computer or phone. All of these electronic groupsets are expensive and they should just come with these built into the shifters.
I bought the module and installed it and I also find the phone app to be pretty bad to use and the head-unit control is pretty laggy. Like ½ second after a press laggy to the point where you’d almost be better off taking your hand off the hood to just press the head-unit button as you’d be able to do that whole process faster than you’d be able to using the integrated shifter buttons. Likewise, there is the same amount of lag when your head-unit updates its gear selection…which is less offensive but Di2 shifts so quickly that you can get substantially far down or up the cassette before your head-unit displays your first shift.
The junction box where you plugin your charger and check your battery life/shift modes could be designed a tad better to me. The button itself is actually a little hard to press, and when pressed it actually doesn’t come on unless you hold it down for a few moments. This can be a little tricky for new riders, but once you figure it out it’s not the end of the world.
In short I’d say that Ultrega Di2 is definitely worth the upgrade over mechanical shifting and I also don’t feel like I’m missing out on tons compared to the SRAM AXS groupsets. It’s pretty clear that Shimano came up with a pretty bullet-proof design at the expense of some UI goodies. You can certainly enjoy riding your bike with a good ole mechanical groupset, but if you’ve done your years on mechanical you’ll be in heaven with the shifting experience that Di2 offers.
Disc Brakes:
One of my big reasons for buying this bike is because I recently moved to a hillier area and found myself really needing to rely on my brakes on larger descents. To be honest I felt like this was a big safety thing that I really wanted to invest in.
In normal braking circumstances, you really can’t feel much of a difference between rim brakes and disc brakes. The two feel so similar that I was almost disappointed in the disc brakes.
However disc brakes do feel a lot easier to modulate. On long descents I’d often find myself white knuckling my brakes, whereas on my disc brakes it’s much less of an ordeal. I will also say that in more of an emergency braking situation, I think the disc brakes will ultimately stop quickefaster…it’s just not quite the night and day difference I thought it was going to be.
I will say that the brakes on my S5 feel like they are setup quite well. There’s no detectable rub and no hugely problematic squeals or howls. So that’s been a bit of a plus at least.
I do actually really like thru-axles though. With rim brakes I always found it a little annoying trying to center the wheel up on the fork and between the brakes. Thru axles just remove that process entirely. The S5 comes with a pretty nifty quick release thru axle system as well…not that if I have a flat I’m going to be worried about precious seconds ticking away, but it’s cool to see new clever designs and systems in place here.
I came from a “rim brakes are better” mindset for a very long time. If you have that mindset switching to disc really isn’t going to feel all that different day to day (for better or worse) but in more extreme situations discs are likely going to have a little more to offer in keeping you safe. So I’d say disc brakes aren’t the only reason why should upgrade your bike, and at the same time if you’re on a rim bike that you love you likely aren’t missing tons by not jumping to disc aside from maybe the ability to run some of the newer wheelsets.
Wheelset:
The bike came with DT Swiss Arc Dicut 1450’s, which are the OEM version of the 1400 series. The wheels are 62mm thick and have a more traditional rim width/profile of 17mm
For such a deep section wheel they are actually incredibly light to hold. I have a set of aluminum 28mm wheels that have a claimed weight around 1580 grams and the 1450’s feel lighter even with discs installed.
I personally really wanted a loud freehub to help let people know that I am nearby and sadly the freehub is pretty quiet. The good news is that you can pretty easily upgrade the ratchet for around $150, which I’ll probably do at some point.
I was a little worried that these would blow around a bit in the wind with how deep they are and how thin the rim width is. However they’ve been fine for me so far on the bike. I’m about 160lbs and 6’ tall so not particularly dense by any means. I think what helps is the bike puts you in a position where you feel like you have a relatively low center of gravity.
In terms of speed, they’re a little hard to pick a part as the whole bike generally just feels “fast” to me, but I feel like they’re doing their job, and don’t have any major complaints thus far. I also feel like they are quite comfortable on the road and that fastemore modern wheelsets are definitely out there, but that you’d be paying for gains you may not fully notice.
Garmin Vector 2’s:
My bike came with some Garmin Vector 2 pedals, which was a bit of a plus for me because I didn’t want to buy a bike and then spend $650ish on a new power meter after the fact.
These are a last gen power meter and do have some less than ideal characteristics (like the external pods which could get damaged in a crash). Likewise from what I’ve heard there’s a bit more of a process when changing them between bikes thanks to the pods. But since they’re already on the bike and ready to go I figure they’ll be just fine for me.
So far power numbers seem pretty much in line with what I output on my Saris H3 trainer. If they differed slightly, I honestly wouldn’t care all that much. They do provide quite a few cool parameters to look at. Pedaling smoothness, left right balance, torque, and loads more that feel like they are more pedal power meter specific.
I was primarily interested in a dual sided power meter to try to detect any left-right leg imbalances that I may have. So far I’ve been pretty much sitting at a 51/49 split most of the time. So if you’re on the fence about getting a dual sided power meter and really want to save a few hundred bucks you’re probably okay doing so!
A small plus to me is the fact that these run on coin cell batteries. There’s obviously some advantages of having rechargeable batteries built into things nowadays but it’s almost to the point where I feel like I have to plug in 3-4 things after each ride. So just being able to keep a few coincells in the saddle bag and being able to swap batteries when necessary actually feels much nicer to me than having to plug these in.
I was actually pretty hesitant to pickup a pedal based power meter because I’ve been using Shimano pedals and cleats for so long. However I actually like the feel of the Garmin pedals much better. They lock your feet in more securely, even if you have a fairly loose tension, and they seem like they stay balanced a lot better than my Shimano pedals (less trying to chase a spinning pedal when you clip in). The only thing that I don’t like is it feels like the front of the cleat doesn’t quite disengage cleanly on my right foot, which is the one that I use most often when stopping, but my left cleat unclips just fine. There’s likely something I’m doing wrong, and it hasn’t been a huge issue, but I do worry that when unclipping my right foot might get stuck and I’ll tip over.
This is actually my first time riding outside with power and I really think the cycling community overhypes how much data you need. As long as you have a watt number to look at, you’re probably good. If you can achieve that with a $300 crank based meter, great! You definitely don’t need to go out and buy some $1000 power meter with all sorts of metrics.
What’s also interesting is since most of my actual training is done on Zwift I find power to be a less useful metric outdoors than it is indoors. When I’m outdoors I’m basically going “hmm this feels like 250 watts to me” and then I look down and go “yep that’s 250 watts” and I do find it interesting to see what certain wattages feel like at certain speeds and up certain hills but it feels less important outdoors than it does in Zwift. For instance if I’m riding on a segment of road…yes I can go 400 watts if I really want to, but I’m already going 25mph and going faster may be a little unsafe in a given situation. If you already have a trainer at home, that’s a far better tool to crank out the watts because you can push yourself to whatever wattage you want without having to worry about traffic, road obstacles, etc.
All in all I’m pretty happy with these pedals and glad I didn’t have to buy a power meter separately when purchasing this bike.
Final Thoughts:
When I pulled the trigger on this bike I experienced quite a bit of guilt. I’m not that fast of a cyclist, $6200 is quite a bit of money, what if the geometry is too aggressive? and my old bike is honestly working just fine. However after riding it I am really happy with my purchase.
To me, the S5 is really one of the coolest looking bikes released. It’s so nice to look at everyday and when I’m on it I really like I’m riding a Lamborghini. There’s just a real sense of occasion to the bike that is totally worth the cost of admission. Now what I will say is that I really think $6Kish is the absolute most you need to pay for a bike nowadays. $6K should generally get you a high-end frame, decent wheelset, electronic shifting and maybe a power meter, which should be all of the high-end goodies you really need. To me there’s no way in hell a $12K bike is going to be anywhere near twice as good as a $6K bike so you really don’t need to spring for a super high-end build with Dura-Ace or SRAM Red.
I’d also argue that the S5 is basically one of the most advanced framesets available today and compared to my 10-year-old roadbike, it’s a substantial leap forward but not a complete game changer in terms of riding my bike. I’d say it adds about 30% more enjoyment compared to what I’m used to experiencing. So if you’re already on a somewhat new bike (say from the last 5 years) you probably aren’t going to notice as much of an improvement in the experience as I did.
This bike really feels like a TT bike and a roadbike had a baby. This shouldn’t be a shock to anyone, because that’s the whole aerobike concept. But it honestly feels as aero as my TT bike, just without the ability to get into the TT position, and it’s not like I’m missing tons of the traditional “roadbike” experience. It handles well, is comfortable, and is generally a pretty responsive bike to be on.
So if you’re torn between an aerobike or more standard roadbike, both are probably going to work just fine, but I’d postulate that the aerobike is likely going to be the faster option without significantly compromising your riding experience in any meaningful way.
I’m a bit of a lone wolf and I think this bike is perfect for us solo riders. You can cover quite a bit of ground with the extra efficiency this bike provides, but it’s obviously much more versatile than a TT bike as you can use it to hop in a group ride if you need to, and it will feel more comfortable riding it up hills, down descents, etc.
Perhaps a con of this bike is that I do feel like I have a bit of a target on my back, and so I subconsciously feel the need to ride fast just so I’m not “that guy” who has the nice bike but sucks at riding. Likewise this bike just really likes to and wants to go fast, so it actually may not be the best tool for noodling around and exploring. I don’t want to say that it’s uncomfortable or anything like that…it’s just very focused on speed so when you’re on it you just want to go fast.
All in all, I’m happy with the bike and think it’ll put a smile on my face for a very long time and I’d be happy to answer more specific questions about it if it would help anyone!

I am 29 years old, make £23,500/year as a service advisor in the North East of England and last week I “unexpectedly” ”bought” a house.

I am 29 years old, make £23,500, live in North East England and work as a service advisor for a bank (Fair warning if you find chat about buying houses boring you may want to sit this one out)
Section One: Assets and Debt
Savings account balance:
Help To Buy ISA- £6,590.57 (when I come to buy a house the government will give me a 25% bonus for balances up to £12,000- it pays 2.05% interest at the minute as well as the eventual bonus)
Marcus Savings - £5,009.67 (pays 0.5% interest which isn’t great, but it’s handy to have my savings somewhere I can keep them out of my mind)
Pension - £14,676.01 (have to be honest I only looked this up to have a figure to put in here and it gave me a small panic attack when I checked)
Checking account balance - £12.64 (this is the amount of money I have left in bills this month)
Credit card debt - £0.00
Student Loan - 20,978.46 (again I only looked this up for the diary!)
Section Two: Income £1,937.50/month - £1,534.04 take home
(£188.00 Tax
£137.46 National Insurance
£28.00 Student Loans
£50.00 sharesave scheme)
Section Three: Expenses
Savings contribution: £1,506.45
Union: £14.95
Phone Insurance: £10.15
iCloud: £2.49
Debt payments: £0
SIDE NOTE: Me and my partner have recently changed how we manage our finances as we are saving for a house- I moved into a flat that he had already been living in for a few years, so all of the bills came out of his account already- previously I would transfer him half of the rent/bills each month & then we would separately pay for our food [I’m veggie/he’s not] and subscriptions & separately put aside savings. From January’s payday I transfer almost all of my money into savings each month -only keeping bills from my account that need to stay for discount/membership reasons- and he pays all bills/food/expenses from his wage, transferring over any leftover to savings at the end of the month. I can pop the costs that I would traditionally have paid in the comments if people would like to see though.
ABOUT ME- I live with my partner J and my dog, who will be referred to as “the boy” throughout because that’s what we call him most of the time anyway I was sent to work from home in May of last year, my partner still works out of his office.
DAY ONE: 7:30 - sunlight alarm goes off, promptly shut it off and snuggle with the Boy, I have been really crampy the last few days & having a Velcro dog that basically sleeps on top of me has been like having an expensive, farting hot water bottle that eats slippers.
8:00 - the Boy stretches out and sticks a paw directly into my eye, okay I guess I’m getting up now! Feed him breakfast, eat a yoghurt, a mini soreen Malt loaf & drink a coffee, it’s the 1st of the month so I log in to my mobile banking & move £200 to my Help To Buy ISA (I get paid around the 23rd of the month so I transfer £200 to a random savings account on payday & keep it there until the 1st when I’m next allowed to pay money into the ISA) my phone insurance has come out today (£10.15) so my current account balance now sits at the grand total of £2.49
9:00- J heads off to work, I have another coffee and eat a mini pack of jammie dodgers.
12:50- Oo J is home for lunch! Work has been manic all day &I haven’t managed to take a break yet, take this as a sign to have a rest, make myself lunch (fried egg, avocado & quorn ham sandwich, pickled onions, gherkins & a packet of salt and vinegar crisps) J tells me about a doggie subscription box ran locally & we decide to sign up for it for the Boy (£11.99/month but it won’t be charged this week) J heads back to work & I take the Boy out for a walk. Browse houses on Rightmove & enjoy the sunshine & fresh air.
16:18- work has gotten no less manic, grab my last break far too late, eat more mini jammie dodgers & have another coffee (believe it or not I am on a diet and have lost 59.5lbs so far, but the joys of CICO mean as long as I have “budgeted” for snacky snacks I still lose weight!) Chase the Boy around the house for a bit, immediately regret it because he is HYPED up and I will have to do another hour of work soon...
19:11- I am in the bath! Excitement has happened, We have found a house! It’s in the right area (we are verrrry specific about where we want to live, it’s basically either this estate we are on now or “the fancy” estate next to us) this house is on the fancy estate! In our budget! I show it to J and he loves it too! We have done some furious scribbling some scrap paper and we can afford it with our finances as they are, okay things would be TIGHT, (we weren’t planning on buying for another few months) but it’s not outside of the realms of possibility, immediately share the house listing with all my friends and start mentally moving in, I have called to arrange a viewing and they’re calling back to sort out a time tomorrow morning! Exciting! I realise I shouldn’t be over excited but am allowing myself an evening of giddiness before my serious “29-year old home buying with my long term partner”face comes out. (In case people would like to know I had a home made cottage pie and veg for my tea while doing maths)
20:56- spend the evening stressing out about minute things- what do you wear to a house viewing? What if they realise I’m not a real grown up?? What kind of questions do I need to ask so they don’t cotton on that I am a Pretend Adult? Head to bed and fall asleep by about 10:30
TOTAL SPEND DAY ONE: £0.00
DAY TWO 7:30 - alarm, snuggles with the boy - eventually get up, eat a yoghurt, a banana and a malt loaf, drink two cups of coffee.
9:30 - work starts, my computer hates me so while it plays up I google some more house related things- solicitors costs/surveys/all sorts and play about with the budget spreadsheet- it’s all a bit precarious if we go ahead with this house we have found but we can definitely make it work.
11:37 - estate agents call! They call a few times today as there was a bit of confusion about when the owners would be able to let us view the property, it’s eventually confirmed for Thursday at 6:30, we are to wear masks (of course) and I will take me and J a hand sanitizer each to use in case we accidentally touch anything. Estate agent adds me on Facebook -bit weird? But it actually works out for the best as I had a few little questions about the property that she’s able to fire back at me with in between doing my work.
13:10 - make lunch, same as yesterday, quorn ham, fried egg and avocado sandwich, walk the boy, it is FREEZING and snowing/sleeting the whole way around our normal lunch time loop. Text with J about the house viewings, he reminds me not to get too over excited which is honestly a fair assumption, I am a known panic buyer & we can’t really afford to panic buy a three bed semi... agree to do an AIP (Agreement In Principle) tonight to show the estate agents if they need it soon.
17:45 - I finish work late as I am stuck on a webchat with a client, it ends just a few minutes before I would have been able to log it as additional time worked. I oven a veggie cottage pie and microwave some mixed veg, we fly through the AIP & we check into the wait times for a mortgage appointment (might be a little premature but Mortgage Appointments were like hens teeth until recently with the government announcing the Stamp Duty holiday- the rich get richer...) they have loads available to book for next week so we hold off until after actually viewing the house (see! Sensible me)
19:02 - I am a creature of cramp & habit so I am in the bath! Message with my friend Z who lives in Canada- I miss her so much, her parents are applying to adopt some kittens! I am very excited for them. (UPDATE- they were accepted! They get 2 kittens soon, the pictures I have seen of them make them look furious, I love them intensely already)
21:30 - bed with the canine hot water bottle- still crampy.
TOTAL SPEND DAY TWO: £0.00
DAY THREE 7:30 - alarm! The Boy decides today is not a day to lie in so I get up, let him out, feed him and then myself (he gets dog food I, shockingly, eat a banana, a yoghurt, a malt loaf and drink some coffee) I start researching local conveyancing solicitors, a few have auto quote options on their website so I run our scenario through them and get a few ideas.
9:30 - work starts, I am still idly researching house things while speaking with clients- I work in a mortgage related job so it’s fairly easy to have a little nose at things and see how they would impact our (theoretical) purchase. The Boy trots up to me part way through work and somehow has found a glass ear plug that I lost about 5 weeks ago, we had torn the house apart looking for it and no joy, no clue where he has found it, the weird little hoarder, but I’m happy to have it back!
12:20 - make myself lunch, quorn ham, fried egg, avocado sandwich, make the boy lunch (dog food) and take him out for a very quick walk, it is freezing cold and sleeting/snowing/raining but he tends to get sassy in the afternoons if he doesn’t get out for at least 15 minutes. Text with friends about my general house worries- I am very good at arguing myself in circles (what a useless skill) and spend all day flip flopping between believing that we (me, the Boy & J) need a 4+ bedroom house with multiple reception rooms, and believing that is total lunacy and far more than we would ever need and that a 3 bed is just right for us.
17:30 - finish work for the day, check in on J and the Boy, J got home from work about 15 minutes before I finished so I catch him up on today’s mental gymnastics, I spent all of my remaining breaks today putting together scenarios of what our costs would look like if we went for this house/a house of a similar price vs a largemore expensive house so I run down the figures with him- he’s on board that a 3 bed should be plenty (child free life simplifies things a little) and points out that my justification for a 4th bedroom (I want a dedicated guest room, not a guest room/office) would be the equivalent of paying £40,000+ interest for the sake of my laptop not being in the same room as the spare bed... he makes a good point that man. & honestly... how often do I have guests? AND when Z, my Canadian pal comes to stay... I will obviously not be at work/needing to use the office anyway as I would be taking annual leave.
18:30 - I oven myself some veggie sausages and mash, make J an omelette, keep my now daily tradition of taking a bath & google lots of versions of “how to buy a house”
22:00 - I’ve spent the evening looking at interior design instagrams (why is everything grey??) and watching my new comfort show (the new season of drag race- just those episodes on repeat) and occasionally shouting ideas through to J who is in the games room/office shooting things?
TOTAL SPEND DAY THREE: £0.00
DAY FOUR 7:30- It’s house viewing day! The Boy is awake, feed him dog food, feed me a banana, a yoghurt and a malt loaf- the Boy has clearly figured out that something is afoot with the house viewing excitement and reacts to this by screaming into the void for two hours. Try and find clothes with no holes in that vaguely fit for the viewing, I feel like I want to be taken seriously but also that it feels respectful to be dressed ...not like a womble when we are going to someone else’s home.
9:30- faff about at work, mainly chat to work friends about the house sitch, eat more malt loaf, fail to pay attention to anything
13:30- walk the boy, text my friends incessant count downs to the house viewing, I am insufferable, I had quorn ham, avocado and fried egg sandwich because of course I did - run into a lady I see often see walking her boy (a border terrier baby!) and have a very distanced chat about the house viewing- she immediately knew what house I was viewing and so I told her I would never forgive her if she bought it.
18:10 - work is over, shoes are on and we are off to the viewing!
19:03 - back from the viewing, we loved it, perfect size for us, had clearly been taken care of, good garden, planning permission for a garage conversion! It’s gorgeous, we are going for it! J chats with his parents and I chat with mine, fill them in on the viewing and the lovely vibes we got. Message the estate agent saying we loved it and want to talk more about the next steps tomorrow.
TOTAL SPEND DAY FOUR: £0.00
DAY FIVE 03:30 - I am suddenly wide awake and WORRIED, where will we put our coats in the new house? Where will the coats go??? Panic about this for roughly two hours, finally get back to sleep and it feels like I just close my eyes when the alarm wakes me up.
07:30 - up and at ‘em, feed the Boy, feed the Me, drink a load of coffee, tell J about my night time panic, he reminds me that hooks exist... god love that man.
10:23 - call the estate agent to confirm we are going to be calling together later to discuss, she sends over a pack of information to read, read through it and send J a rough idea.
13:00 - an offer has been made! We offer asking price, I had googled a load of nearby sold prices and estimates and it seemed like a really fair price for what we are getting, they say they will call back when they have spoken with the seller
14:12 - the estate agent calls back, the sellers are happy to accept the offer but want help with the selling fees (£1000), it’s not really something we tend to do in the UK but agree to speak with J about it. We check the terms of the fees & it’s refundable if the sale falls through.
15:32 - me and J have discussed the fee (& Js dad for a bit of an outside view- Js dad lives alone so is part of our “bubble” but he also loves his own company so we don’t see a great deal of him, before this week we last saw him on Christmas Day) we agree that if the seller had just priced the house at £1,000 more than what we had offered initially, we still would have viewed the house and offered asking price... so a bit of a weird way to do it, but we agree to pay the fees and asking price- we get an invoice sent through to pay and the house is officially off the market! It is ours! No more viewings allowed, no gazumping! Ours... subject to actually getting a pesky mortgage! (J and his Dad disappear at this point as he needs to get his car dropped off for his MOT which is why he came over)
18:30 - (J is back, his dad will take him back to pick up the car tomorrow) we have spent some time checking and rechecking figures, it all works but I like to make sure- agree to tighten our budget up to give us some more breathing space, we are aiming at spending less than £50/week on food for us and The Boy, should be doable, but tight. I ring up the bank to see how to get an appointment with a Mortgage advisor, they say it’s easier if J opens an account so he’s considered an existing customer- that they can book an appt for us if he isn’t a customer but that we would need to visit a branch which feels unsafe to do when we have another option. I feel like we should celebrate a little & remember I have £20 on the mantelpiece from my birthday- I buy us a takeaway, mushroom pizza and garlic sauce for me, kebab for J (£13.50) have a glass of coffee liquor & J has a rum.
22:30- we have made a list of all the things we need to do next week, find a solicitors, book a mortgage appointment, have a nervous breakdown, I head to bed, shockingly mixing pizza, coffee booze & excitement does not end well and I get about 3 hours of sleep.
TOTAL SPEND DAY FIVE: £1,013.50
DAY SIX 8:30 - the boy has no real concept of a lie in, demands to be fed, I get up with him to give J a lie in (he’s just worked 7 days in a row so I feel he deserves one) I eat my yoghurt/malt loaf/banana aund sit down with my coffee, the boy immediately falls asleep on me on the sofa, I watch the new episode of drag race while texting with friends about it/the house sitch.
10:30 - the boy is demanding his walk, so I get ready and take him out, call a family friend, S, and fill her in on the whole house situation! I’m not really paying attention to where we walk and we end up on the same street as the new house - so I take the boy to visit (the outside) of our new house!
11:45 - back from the walk, J has been told his car will cost £120 to get up to scratch, cracking- just what we needed- he pays for this but the lines between his and my money is admittedly blurring more and more these days. He goes to pick up the car.
15:00 - off to do the weekly shop, I have made a list of things to buy and have planned out the weeks menu to keep it under budget. We buy yoghurt, malt loaf, milk, 2.5kg potatoes, 1kg of pasta, tinned tomatoes, treats for the boy, bananas, biscuits, bread, eggs, bubble bath, veggie meatballs, a frozen pizza, frozen vegetables, coffee , cherry Pepsi max (my true weakness- I am going to cut back though as this was 16.6% of our shopping cost this week! These cans must last me until the end of the month at least) the shop comes to £51.25
18:00 - me and J watch a film together (hotel Artemis, it’s actually really good) and chill out on the sofa, he has been working the last 7 days on the trot so I feel like we haven’t had much quality time together, it’s nice to lie down and chill out, we chat about what our priorities are in doing up the new house, what we need to buy first and what can wait & start looking at sofas and beds that we like.
22:00 - bed time for me as I am knackered, the Boy stays up with J, little turncoat.
TOTAL SPEND DAY SIX: £51.25 (not counting the MOT as it’s not my car!)
DAY SEVEN 9:30 - oh frabjous day! A little lie in! I am apparently now of the age where waking up any time past 9:00 feels incredibly decadent! The dream, I get up, eat a malt loaf, drink a coffee, feed the boy & turn on Sunday Brunch (a sort of ...cooking chat show? It’s 3 hours long and I watch it every weekend because I am an old lady)
12:30 -Sunday brunch is over, J is up and has logged into the app the bank told us to use to be able to book an appointment, it actually seemed really easy! I call up straight after it is booked and make an appointment for Thursday, they send out a link with some information we have to read and “e-sign” and they request some documents from us, I log in and upload them right away, J has to get some documents from work so he will do his on Monday.
13:45 - we both take the Boy out, fully intending to take him on a very long walk, it is FREEZING though so he gets a few loops of our standard lunch time walk and I promise him that when it is not so cold that my eyebrows hurt I will take him on a long adventure.
16:00 - we have picked our solicitors out, need to call them on Monday to make sure they can work for us, they were suggested by a friend and Js dad also mentioned he had good experiences with them- good enough reason for me!
18:30 - watch some twitch with J and the Boy, have a small wobble about whether the house is right for us, talk it through with J & I realise that it’s not that the house isn’t “right” it’s that I am catastrophising in my head and trying to talk myself into not wanting the house so I don’t get disappointed if it falls through, think about the house some more and realise that when the anxious part of my brain quiets down I do feel really calm and positive about the house. And if it isn’t meant to be, it isn’t meant to be, but that the universe does not need my bad vibes encouraging something to go wrong- remember my dad always used to say “PMA” at times like this- Positive Mental Attitude, take that memory on board and feel a lot calmer.
23:30 - the Boy fell asleep on me on the sofa and I didn’t have the heart to move him, J rustles something in the games room, the dog assumes it’s crisps and wakes up to investigate, I seize my opportunity and head to bed.
TOTAL SPEND DAY SEVEN; £0.00
Week total: £1,065.02
Food + Drink: £64.24
Fun / Entertainment £0.00
Home + Health: £0.00
Clothes + Beauty: £0.78 (bubble bath)
Transport: £0.00
Other: £1,000.00
Reflection: I started this diary with the caveat that it would be incredibly dull... and it’s still not been the most wild of rides but I definite did not think that I would be making strides to buying a house this week! Except for the (obvious) non-standard spending, I would say the week was about normal money wise- although we wouldn’t usually buy a takeaway every week, and J wouldn’t have to pay for his MOT any other week.
I have been making a note of dates/amounts/appointments for home buying things and hopefully I will be able to put together a home buying diary!

Newbie: God Factory LV Monogram Neverfull from TS Anna

Autochess: Market Status and Design Analysis [effort post]

It really helps me if you check the original article & more similar at https://jb-dev.net/ !!!
https://preview.redd.it/336cy55x9pg61.png?width=1024&format=png&auto=webp&s=c89b35c152f61892f277a28203e61f192a86d260
In January 2019, Drodo Studio’s Dota Auto Chess mod became insanely popular. Many companies (including household names like Valve, Riot, Ubisoft and Blizzard) rushed to release their own versions.
It seemed like the beginning of something big like MOBA or Battle Royale. But it has been more than a year now and the hype seems to have vanished completely. As quickly as it rose, it went away…
This is the first on a series of articles where we will analyze the autochess genre. Here we will be exploring the genre’s history, its current market situation and its audience. And also, what are the core design issues that autochess suffers and that no one has been able to solve yet.
u/JB: For this article I’m teaming up with my mate Victor Freso, one of my most talented folks at Pixel Noire Games, who helped me review all the games.
We also had feedback of ~300 highly engaged players from the different autochess reddit communities, which participated in an online poll whose results are available here. They’re especially thanked at the end of the article.

A HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE

This wasn’t the first time that a mod got the spotlight and ended up becoming the foundation of a genre. It happened in several major, industry-defining cases before (some of which are Team Shooters, MOBAs, Battle Royale…). But on some of these cases events unfolded differently. So we identify 3 distinctive eras related to the evolution of the industry:

1st Era (2000s): Assimilation

The company whose original software had been modded (or had a close enough game, like Valve) moved quickly to absorb the successful mods and turn them into even more successful products.
Since at that point creating a major game release was very complex (required an expensive development, publishing deals and an infrastructure to distribute the product), the deal was profitable for both sides. But it meant the dissolution of the identity of the original creator team, which became embedded in the bigger company culture.
Team Fortress (1999) was originally a Quake mod. And Counter-Strike (2000) started out as a fan-made mod on the Half Life engine. Both games (and creators) were quickly absorbed by Valve.
2nd Era (2010s): Integration
By this time, the previous era model still was going on… but the gaming industry had significatively grown a lot and it was also possible for smaller or even new companies to lure the original developers, and use the mod as a proof for commercial success in order to secure funding and develop it as a full title.
The main characteristic of this era is that the original developers were able to keep a bigger share of control and relevance, rather than being integrated as just another gear on a bigger machine, because the companies they joined built their own identity around that key product.
This was the case of Riot Games: They were able to raise enough money for the creation of their company through family and angel investors, and then hire some of the original creators of DOTA, and then created League of Legends.

![img](1vsle6y3apg61 " Defense of the Ancients (DotA), the foundational title for the MOBA genre, appeared in 2003 as a fan-made custom scenario of Warcraft 3. Foreseeing commercial potential on a full game based on the concept, Riot games and Valve both battled for the Dota IP and the original developers, eventually releasing rival titles League of Legends and Dota2. Interestingly, Blizzard (owners of Warcraft 3) tried to replicate the success without the mod creators in Heroes of the Storm (2015), which hasn’t been as successful as the other two. ")
A similar case happened with battle royale, which also started in 2013 as a successful DayZ mod created by the modder nicknamed PlayerUnknown. Later, it was transformed into a full product through the acquisition of the developer by a korean company (which would later be renamed as the PUBG Corporation, again showing how the company grew around the game rather than assimilating it).
Interestingly, this genre already hints what would happen with Auto Chess, since Fortnite wasn’t involved in any way with the original creators. They just copied the concept. Fortnite was a product stuck in a kind of development hell (had been 6 years in the works). As the game was getting close to the release, the developers became impressed by PUBG’s success, so they created a quick Battle Royale spin-off which became insanely popular and eventually ate the rest of the game.
![img](3b6l2rx6apg61 " Player Unknown’s Battlegrounds (2017), foundational title of the modern battle royale genre, is the successor of PlayerUnknown’s DayZ: Battle Royale, a popular mod for DayZ (which on itself is a mod of ArmA3, making it a mod of a mod lol). The success of PUBG inspired Fortnite (a title on the later stages of a troubled development at the time) to spin towards that genre, becoming PUBG‘s main competitor. ")

3rd Era (2020s): Fragmentation

In all the cases presented previously, the newborn genre ended up in the release of one or two titles which accumulated most of the business. But this hasn’t been the case here.
In Autochess, the newborn genre has been quickly fragmented into a big list of competitors. Some are standalone games (like DOTA Underlords or Autochess: Origins), but there’s also several service-model games which released their autochess mode as well (like Hearthstone’s Battlegrounds or TeamFight Tactics, which at the end of the day is a side-game mode of League of Legends).
This creates an interesting precedent, which I believe will define future cases where an innovative new game concept appears: The hot idea will be cloned very fast because today the main bottleneck in the industry is having an innovative design that generates player interest and engagement.
By 2020, it’s way easier to create and distribute a game, there are way more developers hungry for a hit than ever before, and a lot of service-model games with short development cycles always looking for something juicy for their next update… so new ideas becoming red oceans fast will be the norm.
For sure, this won’t affect the ability of small developers and modders to innovate, but it will affect their ability to leverage that to become successful on an independant level, before they get cloned.
Dota Auto Chess, was a Dota 2 mod which obtained massive popularity. After a failed acquisition from Valve (owners of Dota), the mod developers (Drodo Studios) went to create the mobile standalone Auto Chess: Origins, while still maintaining the PC version linked to Valve. Meanwhile, Riot, Valve, Ubisoft and many other companies developed and released their own autobattlers at a record time, downgrading the genre creators to just another competitor.
And ultimately, they haven’t fixed the core issues of the original game, which separates it from a true hyper-successful product like MOBA.

MARKET STATUS

Because of the rain of clones, it’s hard to map all the autochess games on the market. It doesn’t help that some of them are available in both PC and Mobile (playable in PC, Mac, Android and iOS), and also they’re exclusive to different PC stores (Dota Underlords is only on Steam, TFT is on Riot’s LoL launcher, and Autochess Origins is only at the Epic Store…).
And if that wasn’t enough, the Auto Chess mod in DOTA2 is still very active and has no signs that it’s going to be dying soon. It’s still being regularly updated, and presumably still profitable: Some months ago they added a battle pass system, with its revenue shared between Valve and Drodo.
https://preview.redd.it/081hvwjdapg61.png?width=854&format=png&auto=webp&s=34af2ba4751130a95b422ca1b7fd8c346029ab74
What’s interesting is that none of the contenders has been able to become massively successful in terms of monetization, at least not in terms comparable to even a second or third tier MOBA. And while there are definitively different tiers of following among these titles (led by Riot Games’ TeamFight Tactics), it seems that none of them has been able to gather under its banner a significant amount of players, mobile downloads or Twitch Views…
Sources: AppAnnie (mobile metrics), TwitchMetrics (twitch)
So ultimately, we’re dividing the autochess market into 3 categories: Squires, Would-be Kings and Peasants.

Squires: Rather than standalone games, these are side-modes of already successful products. Under this category we would list the Battlegrounds mode in Hearthstone, or League of Legends’ TFT, and maybe even the original DOTA Autochess mod. While for sure they’ll have their own dedicated audience that only plays those modes, for most players it’s just a nice and fresh activity integrated within a broader game experience. The squires are the ones that have achieved the biggest success among the autochess genre because they don’t suffer as much backlash from the lack of gameplay depth inherent to the genre, which is harmful for the long term retention: Even if the mode eventually becomes a bit shallow, players have many other things to play, and thus are retained. As a consequence, these games can still monetize significatively by selling renewals of their Battle Passes every new season. Not enough to make them successful on the degree that was expected… but at least it’s something. Other than bringing an additional source of revenue, these modes were useful to their core games: They generated player interest by providing innovative gameplay. Hearthstone’s Battlegrounds was an amazing addition to the CCG genre, and made a lot of people come back to the game to discover the new mode and reengage.

The gameplay of TeamFight Tactics (slow tempo, no team coordination, decreased attention requirement…) makes it a nice relief mode to play between LOL matches, which is its purpose in the foreseeable future. If there ever was an intention to make it a standalone game, it vanished together with the player interest on autochess…

Would-be Kings: These are the other two top dogs of the category. They were supposed to rule… but that looking at the numbers they don’t really seem to have ever lifted off. Under this category we would list Auto Chess: Origins and DOTA Underlords. The problem is that their standalone approach means that they suffer the most of the design issues of the genre that we’ve presented in the last section of this article (i.e. flat complexity, lack of mastery depth, lack of progression and rotative meta…). That means that they lost a lot of population over time, and therefore their Battle Pass renewal isn’t as effective at generating revenue : (

DOTA Underlords is an extremely polished product in terms of graphics, character design and UX, and yet another proof that Valve devs really know how to do great games. Too bad they aren’t as good at releasing third installments...

Peasants: Here we would list the myriad of other autochess follower titles that entered the battlefield, each achieving a different degree of success. While some may actually be profitable, what we can be sure about is that none of them has reached any significant numbers or anything close to the reach that brought industry attention.

THE AUDIENCE

We are of the belief that you can’t talk about a game and not talk about who plays it, and that players say more about a game than analyzing all its features and mechanics. So with this in mind we collected answers from ~300 autochess players (check the raw data here). After examining their responses, we’ve identified 3 main player profiles (the comments on each profile are literal):
https://preview.redd.it/zdh1jripapg61.png?width=934&format=png&auto=webp&s=162eb3f8b98024c0a69eb889ca26e7463fdd776c

Patricks, gamers looking for a competitive-but-idle experience that doesn’t require full attention and it’s easily reconcilable with their functional adult life.
Grizzlies, competitive players that struggle with fast paced games that demand a high actions per minute ratio and quick reflexes (like MOBAs or competitive shooters).
Warmasters, highly competitive players that enjoy more the area of strategy (setting up goals and planning how to achieve them) rather than tactics (skillful execution of actions and micromanagement).

What these profiles have in common, other than being hardcore gamers and having a big interest in competitive games, is the fact that they enjoy the lack of micromanagement, and the demand of reflexes and dexterity of autochess.
This is quite interesting, considering that the genre foundation is so close to MOBAs, which are extremely demanding on those aspects. Overall it seems that they belong to audiences below the MOBA umbrella which are currently being alienated by the bulk of ‘younger and dexterity focused’ players.
And when it comes to platforms, it seems that even though the barrier between the classic gaming platforms and mobile is progressively disappearing, the genre is still mainly focused on PC: Out of the ~300 players that answered, 50% said that they play exclusively on PC, 25% played primarily on Mobile, and the remaining 25% played in both.
https://preview.redd.it/1frwgvrtapg61.png?width=962&format=png&auto=webp&s=3602c6a760664333236a2fddbc189fbab3ee3fc1
Players said that they enjoy the focus of the game in planification, as opposed to the focus on execution and performance of MOBAs. And when asked about their main points of frustration, they pointed out 2 main topics: 1.- The strong luck factor that has a strong impact on making you win or lose regardless on how well you played. 2.- The fact that the game eventually becomes shallow and repetitive, fueled by the fact updates were unexciting and not rotating the meta.
Surprised by the fact that players mention randomness as a factor of both enjoyment and frustration? Don’t be! Competitive players tend to have a love-and-hate relationship with luck, because they tend to consider that external factors outside of skills (money spent, better draw…) stole their well deserved victory.
And it’s even more frustrating in autochess, because there’s a strong snowball effect: Players that obtain a big advantage early on in the game become hard to catch later on. Which means that a few bad or good draws early on can decide the rest of the match.
There hasn’t been a single feature more criticised in Magic: The Gathering than the randomness of drawing mana. And yet, luck it’s part of what makes MTG stand out compared to other CCGs: For experienced players, it introduces uncertainty and the need to take risks and gamble, like they’d do in poker. And for rookies, it allows beating someone that has better skills and has a better deck, if Lady Luck is on their side. Won’t happen often, but it will feel awesome when it does. Like a friend likes to say: The best feeling in MTG is to draw a mana when you really need it. And the worst? To draw it when you didn’t.
This goes to say that in autochess, perhaps the power of luck needs to be reviewed, but it would be a bad decision to completely remove luck from the equation.

DESIGN CHALLENGES

In this awesome DoF article, Giovanni Ducati already pointed out the two main problems that the games in this genre need to solve to achieve real success: Bad long term retention and low monetization.
To these issues we would add a third one, which is bad marketability: Contrary to their big brothers League of Legends and DOTA2, these games haven’t been able to achieve high organic downloads (at least not to be able to generate significant revenue through soft monetization mechanics). What’s even worse is that all these games, their themes and target audience are quite close to RPG and Strategy, which are genres with some of the highest CPIs on the market. So they need top-of-the-class retention and monetization to get a high enough LTV to scale up.
But why do these games fail at keeping players entertained for a long time? And why don’t they monetize enough? Here’s what we think:

Flat Complexity & Progression

You have some games out there which have a strong entry barrier due to being quite complicated to grasp. But for those that can deal with the numbers and stats, the depth will keep them entertained for months and years. This is the case in most RPGs and 4X strategy games. And then you have hypercasual games, which are simple and plug and play. So they generate a great early engagement, but are too shallow to keep users hooked for a long time.
As a genre, Autochess games are in the middle ground: they have a high entry barrier, but also lack the complexity to keep players engaged for a long time…
As a general rule, games with long retention tend to follow Bushnell’s Law of being easy to learn and difficult to master. They achieve that by having what we call an unfolding experience: They appear simpler at the beginning (not necessarily easy), but require thousands of hours of practice to master.
An example of this are games that level lock most of the game complexity, so the player understands and masters only a set starter mechanics. And then, progressively unlock new modes and demand more specialized builds and gameplay, repeating the cycle several times to keep the game always interesting while attempting to avoid being overwhelming.
In World of Warcraft, character depth is huge. But this complexity is unfolded progressively, forcing the player to spend time mastering each skill and activity as they level up, before moving further.
Another approach to the same idea are competitive games focused on mechanical ability, dexterity or micromanagement. Like CS:GO or Rocket League. They may unlock all the mechanics from the beginning, but a newbie player will only be able to focus and manage some of them, and then progressively discover and master the rest in an organic way.
Rocket League hides its complexity by matchmaking early players with others of a similar skill. This makes beginner players viable even if they grasp only the basic mechanics. But, as they climb further, they’ll face rivals that take those basic skills for granted and the player will need to master more challenging techniques to keep up.
League of Legends and Overwatch are actually a combination of both: The game first introduces the player to a small selection of heroes which progressively gets expanded, while at the same time having an insane mastery depth that requires a high APM and reflexes, team coordination and thousands of hours of practice.
Contrary to any of those examples, Autochess games throw everything at you from the beginning: Character Skills, Synergies, Unit Upgrade, Gold Management, Items… It’s a lot to swallow. And there’s not even enough time to read what each thing does before the timer runs out. This creates a complex, overwhelming first impression that drives many players out.
But that’s quantity, not depth. Once you’ve gone through that traumatic starting phase, you’ve grasped all the mechanics and you know which team builds are dominating on the meta, it’s just a matter of making it happen by taking the right decisions and adapting to a few key draws.
Eventually, unless luck is really against you, your skills won’t be challenged and you won’t have new mechanics to master. At that point, winning will be based more on the knowledge of the content database and luck rather than your planning and strategic ability. And that’s boring.
So ultimately, these games are hard to grasp for a newbie, but also lack the ability to keep players interested for a very long time since they eventually run out of new features and mechanics to discover and master.

Unexciting Updates, Lack of Collection

On top of that, autochess games seem to have a hard time adding content which reawakens player interest and makes churned ones come back.
The DAU trend that we expect on a long term retention game: A decreasing trend of players until reaching a stagnation stage. At that point, a big update (or new season) is required to attract and reengage users back with new content. This is the model we would see on Fortnite or Hearthstone, but it’s not what we see in most autochesses.
On this topic, perhaps the one that has put the most effort is Riot’s TFT. Each season update, the game releases a new series of heroes, synergies, items and rebalances, as well as a big bunch of cosmetics. This generates a short lived boost on revenue (due primarily to players buying the pass) and downloads, but ultimately nothing that really moves the needle in a relevant way.
‘Why seasonal updates don’t work?‘, you may be asking. Part of the reason is that TFT, as well as every major contender do not include elements of content progression or collection. Instead, they all stick to the roguelike approach of the original mod: Players have access to the same set of units, and build their inventory exclusively during the match.
While at first this seems a good idea, since it keeps the game fair in a similar way to MOBAs, it’s oblivious to the fact that new units do not offer the same amount of gameplay depth as in League of Legends. In LoL, a new unit means weeks or even months of practice until mastering timing, range and usage of the skills, how they interact with every other champion, etc… In comparison, in TFT the new content can be fully explored in just a bunch of matches, both because the new content doesn’t offer that much depth to start with and because it’s available from the moment the player gets the update.
By lacking content progression and collection, autochesses miss the opportunity to create long term objectives after an update, more innovative mechanics and less repetitiveness. As a consequence, they have it really hard to hype players on updates.

Big ‘Snowball Effect’

In game design, the snowball effect refers to the situation where obtaining an advantage or dominance generates further conditions that almost invariably means winning the match. As you can guess, on competitive games this effect can generate a bad experience, especially when the divergence starts early on: The player that obtained the early advantage will keep on increasing the advantage and curbstomp the rest.
For example, this can happen on a Civilization game if a player gets ahead of the rest acquiring key resource territories, and uses them to achieve a greater progress in tech and income at a faster pace than the rest. Or in League of Legends if a team scores a bunch of early kills and levels up, becoming more able at scoring even more kills…
In this match of Age of Empires 2, the red player (Aztecs) managed to decimate the blue player (Turks) military units early on. Since without an army it was impossible for the blue player to secure enough resources to perform a comeback, for the next 2 hours the blue player was in a pointless, hopeless match. Kudos for not abandoning, though!
Autochess games suffer greatly from this effect, due to the following reasons:

Resources lead to victories, victories lead to resources As you know, in autochess each player builds a team based on successive battles. Better battle performance will grant more gold, which is the resource used to buy units, perform shop rolls, etc… Similar to the cases we’ve already explained, this means that players that achieve early dominance will be able to to obtain more gold, use it to get better units and get more victories and gold, therefore increasing their team power faster than the rest. ‘But players can be lucky or unlucky, generating a factor that compensates for the advantage of having more resources early on‘, you may be considering. Unfortunately, this is a flawed logic, because of 2 main reasons: (1) Having more resources means more adaptability: The dominant players will be able to leverage on them to re-adapt their team, therefore outperforming the rest on a randomness-driven scenario. (2) Resources allow to buy more rolls, which diminishes the deviation generated by each individual roll.

![img](4kbmxiqhbpg61 " TeamFight Tactics attempts to decrease the snowball effect by introducing Carousels: rounds where all players pick a character from a list, and where the players that are losing (i.e. have less health) get to choose first. While this decreases the issue, it doesn’t really solve it… It just makes that smart players aim to lose on purpose at the beginning so they can get the better pick and generate the snowball slightly later on. ")

Luck factor. The previous point goes into maintaining and increasing dominance once it has been achieved early on, but another source of frustration is that luck is a huge factor in achieving early dominance. This means that your strategic skills and smarts can be completely invalidated by a couple of bad rolls at the beginning of the match. And there’s nothing that competitive players hate more than having their match stolen by factors outside the pure clash of abilities.

As an antithesis, Poker also has resource management, and luck factor determines the victory (on a specific round). But unlike Autochess, resources can’t override luck, and early victories don’t affect the later chance of winning.

Excessive Match Length

Compared to PC, on mobile is much harder to keep the player focused for a long period of time on a single session. And having a very long minimum session kind of goes against the premise of being able to play anywhere which is a primary strength of mobile as a gaming platform. This is a problem for autochess games since a single match can last for 30-45 minutes of synchronous, nonstop gameplay.
![img](4ed79ecnbpg61 " The knockout mode in Dota Underlords aims to make the game more accessible by skipping the slow beginning of the match (you start with a pre-setup army), and by simplifying the health and fusion systems. This shortens the matches to ~15 minutes, which is still too long for mobile, but better than 30. The problem is that it also increases the snowball effect, since the match has less turns to allow comebacks, and makes any mistake (or a bad roll) way more punishing. ")
‘Isn’t the solution just make the match shorter?’, you’re probably wondering. Unfortunately, there are several reasons that make this more challenging to the core design than what it seems:

Because in autochess the player builds its team from scratch, at the beginning of each match there are several turns to setup team foundations. Removing these early decisions severely decreases the teambuilding possibilities, decreasing overall depth.
Also, each setup phase between clashes requires a minimum time to think and perform the actions. In the last turns of a match, the game can become quite demanding on thinking and input speed.
Matches require a minimum amount of turns to compensate the weight of a single lucky/unlucky roll over the chances to win. Because the possible units for teambuilding appear on random rolls, the less turns there are the more luck factor the game will suffer, and as a consequence the less important the player’s strategic skills will be.
And if there are few turns, there are also less chances for comebacks. Because it means that players will have less setup phases to adapt and catch a player that has obtained an early advantage.
Finally, since the match involves 8 players, it requires a minimum of turns so that they all can fight between each other… Nevertheless, I don’t consider this a critical issue because Dota has been able to change this specific point on the knockout mode without sacrificing too much in terms of depth.

Soft Approach to Monetization

PC/Console approach to free-to-play is generally soft (i.e. primarily based on cosmetics, avoid pay-to-win…), while mobile tends to be quite hardcore in comparison. The softness of PC monetization is even more core to companies such as Valve and especially Riot Games, to which the “no monetization bs” is part of the brand values. This would be very hard to change without harming their reputation.
Same as in most autochess games, in TeamFight Tactics the players can only pay for different cosmetics and for a Battle Pass. Without the massively huge and engaged audience of League of Legends, this monetization approach isn’t able to generate meaningful revenue.
This is not exclusively because we mobile-first devs are a ruthless wallstreet folk which will use every dirty trick in the book to get a bit extra money… but also because mobile games are locked in competition for paid installs. This requires us to get as much revenue as possible from users, as fast as possible, in order to reinvest into players to keep on growing or avoid withering.
The business model of League of Legends or Fortnite is based on their extreme popularity: They already have massive amounts of highly engaged active users, so their strategy is to keep them playing and have a monetization system that, while doesn’t make as much money from the players as it could do on the short term, generates a decent amount of revenue over a longer period of time.
Games that have this soft f2p approach have it very hard to reach enough ARPPU to make paid users profitable, given the insanely high mobile CPIs. This may not be an issue to big IPs and games that are able to bring many organic players (Fortnite, League of Legends…), but it is a big issue for those that can’t attract such a big number of players due to their organic appeal.
Due to its core characteristics (strategic, number-based, complex…), Autochess is unlikely to be a massive appeal product, and therefore won’t fit into the cosmetics model. It’s a game that will have a smaller audience of highly engaged players, and therefore will require a more aggressive monetization to reach similar results.

FINAL THOUGHTS

The history of the autochess genre serves as an example of the risks of design endogamy: The devsphere rushed to clone Auto Chess, and before a year all the major contenders were in the board. But that speed came at a cost: None of these projects has brought the concept much further than its original conception, and in doing so they haven’t solved any of the core issues.
https://preview.redd.it/iw82bogsbpg61.png?width=1280&format=png&auto=webp&s=9a197aa1fcb9ace73d6795103d20a4101ce7ddb5
The folks at Riot games developed the TeamFight Tactics in less than 5 months. This allowed them to release while the hype was still at its peak… but it also meant it added just a couple of improvements, and it’s otherwise very similar to the original Auto Chess mod.
After seeing all these projects fail to meet the big expectations that were placed on them, the question is if perhaps the best approach was to avoid rushing, and instead tackle the genre with a title that is not a clone, but rather a more groomed, accessible and innovative successor of the original idea.
In our next article on this series will make an attempt to see how such a game could be, rethinking the spirit and fresh design ideas of autochess to solve the issues mentioned above. (May take a while though, I want to focus on smaller articles for a couple of months…)
Meanwhile, if you want to read more about this genre, we suggest you these awesome articles from the folks at DoF: Why Auto-Chess can’t monetize – and how to fix that and How Riot can turn TFT into a billion dollar game

Special Thanks to…

These articles wouldn’t have been possible with the collaboration of ~300 members of the reddit communities of the different auto chess games who provided us with feedback and data. You folks have been incredible solving all our doubts. One thing that this genre has is some of the most awesome players around.
So big kudos for Brxm1, Erfinder Steve, Xinth, Zofia the Fierce, STRK1911, LontongSinga22, bezacho, hete, NeroVingian, marling2305, NOVA9INE , asidcabeJ, Eidallor, Rhai, Lozarian, bwdm, Toxic, Ruala, Papa Shango, MrMkay, Dread0, L7, kilmerluiz, Amikals, Sworith, Tankull, B., hete, Bour, Denzel, DeCeddy, Diaa, hamoudaxp, Benjamin “ManiaK” Depinois, Katunopolis, DanTheMan, MikelKDAplayer, 0nid, Tobocto, Tiny Rick, phuwin, Alcibiades, triceps, d20diceman, shadebedlam, stinky binky, Tutu, Myuura, suds, Kapo, Hearthstoned, Engagex, Pietrovosky, Daydreamer, Doctor Heckle, Ignis, ShawnE, NastierNate, LeCJ, Nene Thomas, Chris, trinitus_minibus, Nah, Kaubenjunge1337, Mudhutter, Asurakap, Nicky V, shinsplintshurts, bobknows27, Willem (Larry David Official on Steam), Jonathan, Dinomit24, Monstertaco, GangGreen69, Veshral Amadeus Salieri (…lol!), Kuscomem, Cmacu, Pioplu, Dilemily, qulhuae, Ilmo, MarvMind, facu1ty, crayzieap, Saint Expedite, Lobbyse, Lukino , tomes, Blitzy24, Mcmooserton, magicmerl, i4got2putsumpantzon, radicalminusone, Pipoxo, Kharambit, Bricklebrah, Rbagderp, Merforga, Superzuhong, Mo2gon, MoS.Tetu, MeBigBwainy, Zokus, CoyoteSandstorm, Stehnis, Noctis, Fkdn, Ray, Fairs1912, Fairs1912, Krakowski, HolyKrapp, Damadud, Pentium, Mach, Mudak, CaptSteffo, jwsw1990, Omaivapanda, Inquisitor Binks, Jack, yggdranix, GoodLuckM8, Centy, Prabuddha (aka Walla), dtan, Philosokitteh, Doms, ZEDD, Calloween, Synsane, Kaluma, GordonTremeshko , Djouni, DOGE, haveitall, ANIM4SSO, Task Manager, Submersed, BAKE, Viniv, La Tortuga Zorroberto, BixLe, Rafabeen, Blzane, bdlck666, FatCockNinja86, R.U.Sty, Yopsif, blesk, Quaest0r, FanOfTaylor, StaunchDruid, Rushkoski and everyone else that took some minutes to help us out on the article.

[REVIEW] Chanel Classic Flap M/L in Black Caviar / SHW from Non-TS Kelly and S Factory

Happy holidays, everyone! This is my first review of my first rep bag! I've read through so many of the reviews posted here in the past few weeks; it's been really helpful seeing each of your thoughts on the quality, accuracy, and construction of the reps, so I thought it was due time for me to give back to the community. I know RL is inundated with Chanel CF M/L reviews, but another one can't hurt!
The Chanel Classic Flap M/L has been my dream bag for so long. Like many of you, I have been deterred from buying authentic Chanel due to the SAs, decrease in quality, and exorbitant price increases. I lurked on this sub every now and then, but never pulled the trigger on buying a rep until recently. It's been somewhat of a slippery slope ever since!
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Disclosure: Nothing to disclose. I was not given any discounts or incentives in exchange for this review. Kelly asked me to write a review after I messaged her that the bag arrived, but I was already planning on writing one.
Seller: Non-TS Kelly
Contact Information: WhatsApp: +86 181 001 40127. WeChat: zhongximaoyi. She has a website if you prefer to purchase using this method instead: https://www.luxurykelly.com/
Price: $539 USD - $20 USD = $519 USD. Kelly offered $20 off since I was a first-time buyer.
Payment Method: PayPal G&S
Shipping: FedEx - no additional shipping fee since Kelly ships free of charge.
Order Timeline:

12/2: Added Kelly on WhatsApp and inquired about the availability of the Chanel CF M/L in Black Caviar with SHW and a Chanel Iridescent Yellow Zipped Coin Purse. Asked Kelly about the highest tier she has available for the classic flap and she said S Factory was the best. She had the CF in stock but not the coin purse. Paid via Paypal G&S that night for the CF.
12/8: PSPs received. I expressed concerns about misalignment on the front and back of the bag. Kelly was quick to respond and said it was the angle the photos were taken at and would retake pictures for me. I received additional photos and two videos a few hours later. It still looked misaligned to me but not as bad as the first set of photos looked so I GL'ed. I asked Kelly to send me tracking information once available and she said she would. I never received a tracking number and I'm not sure the date it was actually shipped out. I didn't follow up with her about the tracking number since I was so busy with work and was planning on reaching out after Christmas if I still hadn't received the bag.
12/23: Bag secured! It arrived just in time for Christmas.

CCW since I'm new to QC!
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Photos:

My Photos: Packaging and Bag Itself (+ Close Up Video of Caviar Texture)
Factory Photos
PSPs and Video
Authentic Photos

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Quality: 9.85 / 10

Leather: No fufu smell (yay)!!! The leather smell is a little overwhelming and somewhat resembles the smell of a new car with leather seats. The leather is soft and has a nice sheen to it! It is not that dry, but I think it can still benefit from a coat or two of leather conditioner and plan on doing this soon. The quilts have a nice squishiness to them! The burgundy leather that lines the inside of the front pocket and the mona lisa pocket is incredibly smooth and almost velvety in feel. If this is what lambskin feels like, I am so tempted to get a lambskin bag!
- [-0.05] - On 2 of the quilts of the mona lisa pocket (towards the upper right-hand corner), it looks like there is some glue on the leather. I was able to wipe off the residue, but I am deducting 0.05 points for this.
Stitching: The stitching looks neat, clean, and evenly spaced. I didn't find any loose stitches anywhere. In certain lighting, I feel like the color of the burgundy thread looks a tad too red against the burgundy leather. I've seen this on authentics on FP though.
Hardware: All the hardware has some nice weight to it. The silver is shiny and there are no signs of tarnishing. Both the CC turnlock and the snap button require a little effort / pressure, but both seem pretty sturdy and secure. The zipper for the love letter pocket runs smoothly.
- [-0.10] - There are two small chips / scratches near the top screw on the plate hardware that's on the back of the flap. Both are relatively small and neither are in the PSPs that Kelly sent, so I'm not sure how it get scratched. Again, since this bag has not been used, I am deducting 0.10 points for this. The hardware feels sturdy, so I'm pretty surprised that there are already chips. Hairline scratches are expected with normal wear and tear, but I would not expect dents / chips.

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Accuracy: 8.6 / 10

Diamond Quilting: The diamond quilting on the front of the bag looks even and consistent. The stitch count is around 9 per quilt. There is a nice squishiness when you press gently down on the quilts.
- [-0.50] - On the back of the bag, the last row of diamonds should essentially be a half diamond. I knew the S Factory quilting was inaccurate when I looked at the factory photos and compared it to authentic photos, but never really saw this mentioned in anyone's CF M/L reviews until u/hkcc2505's review which referenced u/ThePinkOnyx's God Factory review. From all the authentics I've seen on TPF, FP, and watching youtubers like Alyssa Lenore / Mel in Melbourne / etc., I've never seen an authentic caviar classic M/L bags with stitched edges have a diamond quilting pattern like the S Factory one. This type of pattern happens with seasonal / non-stitched classic flaps, but shouldn't happen with the permanent caviar classic bags (i.e. the black caviar classic flap with edge stitching). I knew this was inaccurate before buying, but since went ahead with purchasing since 1) it's on the back of the bag, 2) the hype train surrounding non-TS Kelly and S Factory really sucked me in, and 3) no one in my circle is really into designer / luxury goods.
- [-0.25] - On the mona lisa pocket, the size of the diamonds looks inconsistent on the right side. When looking at the bag straight on, the diamonds near the right corner of the pocket look smaller than the surrounding quilts. At an angle, it looks fine so I'm not sure how much it has to do with how much the pocket bulges out. Either way, I don't really see this happening on auths so I deducted 0.25 points.
Alignment: The alignment is one of the main issues for me. I expressed concerns when I received the PSPs and in the additional photos / videos Kelly sent me, it didn't look to bad so I GL'ed. When I finally got the bag, it definitely still looks off to me. It looks ok at certain angles, but when looking at the bag straight on (both the front and the back), I can see areas where it's not as straight as it should be.
- [-0.25] - I am taking off 0.25 points for both the front and the mona lisa pocket. If I were to ever shell out money to buy an authentic classic flap, it would have to be perfectly aligned. I know that there are many authentics out there that have poor alignment, but I could never personally justify paying such a high price for an imperfect bag. When looking head on at the S Factory bag, the front is very slightly misaligned on the left and right side. It's not horrible, but for the sake of review, I am docking some minor points. For me, the bigger issue is the alignment on the back. I think the right side looks off. It might be due to the pocket bulging a little bit, but the lines are not straight and seem to round out. Depending on the angle at which you're looking / taking photos of the bag, the alignment can look worse than it really is.
Leather: I have never felt an authentic Chanel before. The leather feels durable and not super soft. I think it is pretty good quality and does not seem dry (at least in comparison to a classic flap wallet I received from another TS which was super dry and needed 6-7 coats of Cadillac conditioner to soften up). You can feel the texture of the caviar pebbles when you graze your fingers over the leather. The burgundy leather that lines the inside of the pockets is incredibly smooth and so pleasant to touch!
Mona Lisa Pocket: The "smile" looks pretty accurate compared to the authentic.
- [-0.25] - I think the size / shape of the pocket is a little off. On the authentic, the corners of the pocket should cut half of a diamond. On the rep, the bottom corners of the pocket almost completely cover the diamond.
Stamping/Engraving: The stamping on the burgundy leather looks pretty close to the authentic; for the most part, the stamping is clean and crisp. The engraving on the backplate looks to be the correct font and size.
- [-0.15] - 0.15 points lost for somewhat incorrect / messy stamping on the burgundy leather. I think the "A" in "Chanel" is a little too thick compared to the authentic. The bottom of the "N" in "Chanel" also does not seem to match the lettering of the authentics. The "R" and "A" in "France" are too close together. I don't think the letters should connect.
Hardware: The hardware color looks correct (pretty difficult to mess up silver I think). The CC lock on the flap looks to be the correct shape. The flat-head screws on the backplate are correct. The placement of the CC lock, backplate, button, and turnlock post all look pretty good to me.
Stitched Inner CC: The width of the CCs and the space between them appear to be the same. The color of the thread seems to match the color of the leather. Will caveat this by saying that, in certain lighting, the burgundy thread seems a little too red compared to the leather. The button is placed perfectly center above the CCs. The top of the left "C" doesn't look as rounded as it should be. This wasn't really noticeable in the PSPs, but it's super small and I only noticed it when I had my face basically pressed up against the bag lol.
Chains: The chains feels solid and have a nice weight to them. There was one kink in the chain when I first opened the bag, but I was able to quickly fix it. The leather interwoven through the chain does not seem to be glazed on the edges and is sewn together. There is definitely some squeakiness when you move the chains; sounds a little similar to wet sneakers on hard floors lol. The drop length is too long compared to auth.
Authenticity Sticker: I think this looks OK to me - it was pretty difficult getting a good picture of the sticker since it's positioned in the corner of the bag. There are 8 digits on a white sticker covered with clear tape with two gold Chanel logos. There also appears to be "X" cut-lines mirroring the authentic stickers. The font looks good (the 1s have small serifs, i.e. feet). The only thing that looks off is that "Chanel" is printed on the right-side and the dark line on the left. On authentics, it appears to be reversed according to some guides I found. I also couldn't really see any gold flecks on the authenticity sticker with the picture I took. Not taking any points off since it's almost impossible to see the sticker unless you really pry open the bag.

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Satisfaction: 9.5 / 10
I am happy with this bag! I can be somewhat impulsive with my purchases and the hype around Kelly / S Factory made me take the plunge into buying my first rep bag. I think the quality is good, but the misalignment and bottom back diamond quilting being incorrect knocks off 0.50 points. I am WFH for the foreseeable future and rarely leave the house anymore, but I can't wait to show her off once I finally get to do fun activities again! My brother shared in my excitement when the bag arrived and sat with me as I ogled at it. He gives it a 10/10 (even though he knows nothing about bags lol).
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Seller Communication and Service: 9.9 / 10
Kelly was super quick with her responses; she would respond to my messages usually within 10 minutes (as long as it was within her normal business hours). When I expressed concerns about misalignment, she reassured me and sent me additional photos and a video. I took off 0.10 points because she never sent tracking information or confirmed shipment (from other reviews it seems like you need to remind her about tracking). I wasn't too bothered about this since I had a lot going on with work and was too busy to follow up with her about it. That being said, she is kind and friendly. She looked into sourcing the iridescent yellow coin purse that I had inquired about; she found something similar and sent me factory photos, but I had already bought the SLG from TS Anna by that time. I will definitely purchase from Kelly again!
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That wraps up my review! I hope this is helpful to anyone looking to buy a Chanel CF M/L from S Factory / Kelly. I've seen some comments about whether or not S Factory can rival 187. Although I don't own a 187, I still think 187 is the most accurate for caviar classic flaps based on RL reviews and photos. Misalignment is not unheard of on authentic Chanels, but the incorrect diamond quilting pattern on the back of the S Factory is the real giveaway in my opinion. I still really love the S Factory bag and I think it is good quality. I will be shelling out the extra money to buy a beige 187 king classic flap soon and am excited to compare the two bags!

A Detailed Summary of Every Single Reason Why I am Bullish on Ethereum

The following will be a list of the many reasons why I hold and am extremely bullish on ETH.

This is an extremely long post. If you just want the hopium without the detail, read the TL;DR at the bottom.

ETH 2.0

As we all know, ETH 2.0 phase 0 is right around the corner. This will lock up ETH and stakers will earn interest on their ETH in return for securing the network. Next comes phase 1 where the ETH 2 shards are introduced, shards are essentially parallel blockchains which are each responsible for a different part of Ethereum’s workload, think of it like a multi-core processor vs a single core processor. During phase 1, these shards will only act as data availability layers and won’t actually process transactions yet. However, their data can be utilised by the L2 scaling solution, rollups, increasing Ethereum’s throughput in transactions per second up to 100,000 TPS.
After phase 1 comes phase 1.5 which will move the ETH 1.0 chain into an ETH 2 shard and Ethereum will be fully secured by proof of stake. This means that ETH issuance will drop from around 5% per year to less than 1% and with EIP-1559, ETH might become a deflationary asset, but more on that later.
Finally, with ETH 2.0 phase two, each shard will be fully functional chains. With 64 of them, we can expect the base layer of Ethereum to scale around 64x, not including the massive scaling which comes from layer 2 scaling solutions like rollups as previously mentioned.
While the scaling benefits and ETH issuance reduction which comes with ETH 2.0 will be massive, they aren’t the only benefits. We also get benefits such as increased security from PoS compared to PoW, a huge energy efficiency improvement due to the removal of PoW and also the addition of eWASM which will allow contracts to be programmed in a wide range of programming languages, opening the floodgates for millions of web devs who want to be involved in Ethereum but don’t know Ethereum’s programming language, Solidity.

EIP-1559 and ETH scarcity

As I covered in a previous post of mine, ETH doesn’t have a supply cap like Bitcoin. Instead, it has a monetary policy of “minimum viable issuance”, not only is this is a good thing for network security, but with the addition of EIP-1559, it leaves the door open to the possibility of ETH issuance going negative. In short, EIP-1559 changes the fee market to make transaction prices more efficient (helping to alleviate high gas fees!) by burning a variable base fee which changes based on network usage demand rather than using a highest bidder market where miners simply include who pays them the most. This will result in most of the ETH being paid in transaction fees being burned. As of late, the amount which would be burned if EIP-1559 was in Ethereum right now would make ETH a deflationary asset!

Layer 2 Scaling

In the mean time while we are waiting for ETH 2.0, layer 2 scaling is here. Right now, projects such as Deversifi or Loopring utilise rollups to scale to thousands of tx/s on their decentralised exchange platforms or HoneySwap which uses xDai to offer a more scalable alternative to UniSwap. Speaking of which, big DeFi players like UniSwap and Synthetix are actively looking into using optimistic rollups to scale while maintaining composability between DeFi platforms. The most bullish thing about L2 scaling is all of the variety of options. Here’s a non exhaustive list of Ethereum L2 scaling solutions: - Aztec protocol (L2 scaling + privacy!) - ZKSync - Loopring - Raiden - Arbitrum Rollups - xDai - OMGNetwork - Matic - FuelLabs - Starkware - Optimism - Celer Network - + Many more

DeFi and Composability

If you’re reading this, I am sure you are aware of the phenomena which is Decentralised Finance (DeFi or more accurately, open finance). Ethereum is the first platform to offer permissionless and immutable financial services which when interacting with each other, lead to unprecedented composability and innovation in financial applications. A whole new world of possibilities are opening up thanks to this composability as it allows anyone to take existing pieces of open source code from other DeFi projects, put them together like lego pieces (hence the term money legos) and create something the world has never seen before. None of this was possible before Ethereum because typically financial services are heavily regulated and FinTech is usually proprietary software, so you don’t have any open source lego bricks to build off and you have to build everything you need from scratch. That is if what you want to do is even legal for a centralised institution!
Oh, and if you think that DeFi was just a fad and the bubble has popped, guess again! Total value locked in DeFi is currently at an all time high. Don’t believe me? Find out for yourself on the DeFi Pulse website.

NFTs and tokeniation

NFTs or “Non-Fungible Tokens” - despite the name which may confuse a layman - are a basic concept. They are unique tokens with their own unique attributes. This allows you to create digital art, human readable names for your ETH address (see ENS names and unstoppable domains), breedable virtual collectible creatures like crypto kitties, ownable in game assets like Gods Unchained cards or best of all in my opinion, tokenised ownership of real world assets which can even be split into pieces (this doesn’t necessarily require an NFT. Fungible tokens can be/are used for some of the following use cases). This could be tokenised ownership of real estate (see RealT), tokenised ownership of stocks, bonds and other financial assets (which by the way makes them tradable 24/7 and divisible unlike through the traditional system) or even tokenised ownership of the future income of a celebrity or athlete (see when NBA player Spencer Dinwiddie tokenized his own NBA contract.)

Institutional Adoption

Ethereum is by far the most widely adopted blockchain by enterprises. Ethereum’s Enterprise Ethereum Alliance (EEA) is the largest blockchain-enterprise partnership program and Ethereum is by far the most frequently leveraged blockchain for proof of concepts and innovation in the blockchain space by enterprises. Meanwhile, there are protocols like the Baseline protocol which is a shared framework which allows enterprises to use Ethereum as a common frame of reference and a base settlement layer without having to give up privacy when settling on the public Ethereum mainnet. This framework makes adopting Ethereum much easier for other enterprises.

Institutional Investment

One of Bitcoin’s biggest things it has going for it right now is the growing institutional investment. In case you were wondering, Ethereum has this too! Grayscale offers investment in the cryptocurrency space for financial institutions and their Ethereum fund has already locked up more than 2% of the total supply of ETH. Not only this, but as businesses transact on Ethereum and better understand it, not only will they buy up ETH to pay for their transactions, but they will also realise that much like Bitcoin, Ethereum is a scarce asset. Better yet, a scarce asset which offers yield. As a result, I expect to see companies having ETH holdings become the norm just like how Bitcoin is becoming more widespread on companies’ balance sheets.

The state of global markets

With asset prices in almost every asset class at or near all-time highs and interest rates lower than ever and even negative in some cases, there really aren’t many good opportunities in the traditional financial system right now. Enter crypto - clearly the next evolution of financial services (as I explained in the section on DeFi earlier in this post), with scarce assets built in at the protocol layer, buying BTC or ETH is a lot like buying shares in TCP/IP in 1990 (that is if the underlying protocols of the internet could be invested in which they couldn’t). Best of all, major cryptos are down from their all-time highs anywhere between 35% for BTC or 70% for ETH and much more for many altcoins. This means that they can significantly appreciate in value before entering uncharted, speculative bubble territory.
While of course we could fall dramatically at any moment in the current macro financial conditions, as a longer term play, crypto is very alluring. The existing financial system has shown that it is in dire need of replacing and the potential replacement has started rearing its head in the form of crypto and DeFi.

Improvements in user onboarding and abstracting away complexity

Ethereum has started making huge leaps forward in terms of usability for the end user. We now have ENS names and unstoppable domains which allow you to send ETH to yournamehere.ETH or TrickyTroll.crypto (I don’t actually have that domain, that’s just an example). No longer do you have to check every character of your ugly hexadecimal 0x43AB96D… ETH address to ensure you’re sending your ETH to the right person. We also have smart contract wallets like Argent wallet or the Gnosis safe. These allow for users to access their wallets and interact with DeFi self-custodially from an app on their phone without having to record a private key or recovery phrase. Instead, they offer social recovery and their UI is straight forward enough for anyone who uses a smart phone to understand. Finally, for the more experienced users, DApps like Uniswap have pretty, super easy to use graphical user interfaces and can be used by anyone who knows how to run and use a browser extension like Metamask.

The lack of an obvious #1 ETH killer

One of Ethereum’s biggest threats is for it to be overthrown by a so-called “Ethereum killer” blockchain which claims to do everything Ethereum can do and sometimes more. While there are competitors which are each formidable to a certain extent such as Polkadot, Cardano and EOS, each have their own weaknesses. For example, Polkadot and Cardano are not fully operational yet and EOS is much more centralised than Ethereum. As a result, none of these competitors have any significant network effects just yet relative to the behemoth which is Ethereum. This doesn’t mean that these projects aren’t a threat. In fact, I am sure that projects like Polkadot (which is more focused on complimenting Ethereum than killing it) will take a slice out of Ethereum’s pie. However, I am still very confident that Ethereum will remain on top due to the lack of a clear number 2 smart contract platform. Since none of these ETH killers stands out as the second place smart contract platform, it makes it much harder for one project to create a network effect which even begins to threaten Ethereum’s dominance. This leads me onto my next reason - network effects.

Network effects

This is another topic which I made a previous post on. The network effect is why Bitcoin is still the number one cryptocurrency and by such a long way. Bitcoin is not the most technologically advanced cryptocurrency. However, it has the most widespread name recognition and the most adoption in most metrics (ETH beats in in some metrics these days). The network effect is also why most people use Zoom and Facebook messengeWhatsApp despite the existence of free, private, end to end encrypted alternatives which have all the same features (Jitsi for the zoom alternative and Signal for the private messenger app. I highly recommend both. Let’s get their network effects going!). It is the same for Bitcoin. People don’t want to have to learn about or set up a wallet for alternative options. People like what is familiar and what other people use. Nobody wants to be “that guy” who makes you download yet another app and account you have to remember the password/private key for. In the same way, Enterprises don’t want to have to create a bridge between their existing systems and a dozen different blockchains. Developers don’t want to have to create DeFi money legos from scratch on a new chain if they can just plug in to existing services like Uniswap. Likewise, users don’t want to have to download another browser extension to use DApps on another chain if they already use Ethereum. I know personally I have refrained from investing in altcoins because I would have to install another app on my hardware wallet or remember another recovery phrase.
Overthrowing Ethereum’s network effect is one hell of a big task these days. Time is running out for the ETH killers.

Ethereum is the most decentralised and provably neutral smart contract platform

Ethereum is also arguably the most decentralised and provably neutral smart contract platform (except for maybe Ethereum Classic on the neutrality part). Unlike some smart contract platforms, you can’t round up everyone at the Ethereum Foundation or any select group of people and expect to be able to stop the network. Not only this, but the Ethereum foundation doesn’t have the ability to print more ETH or push through changes as they wish like some people would lead you on to believe. The community would reject detrimental EIPs and hard fork. Ever since the DAO hack, the Ethereum community has made it clear that it will not accept EIPs which attempt to roll back the chain even to recover hacked funds (see EIP-999).
Even if governments around the world wanted to censor the Ethereum blockchain, under ETH 2.0’s proof of stake, it would be incredibly costly and would require a double digit percentage of the total ETH supply, much of which would be slashed (meaning they would lose it) as punishment for running dishonest validator nodes. This means that unlike with proof of work where a 51% attacker can keep attacking the network, under proof of stake, an attacker can only perform the attack a couple of times before they lose all of their ETH. This makes attacks much less financially viable than it is on proof of work chains. Network security is much more than what I laid out above and I am far from an expert but the improved resistance to 51% attacks which PoS provides is significant.
Finally, with the US dollar looking like it will lose its reserve currency status and the existing wire transfer system being outdated, superpowers like China won’t want to use US systems and the US won’t want to use a Chinese system. Enter Ethereum, the provably neutral settlement layer where the USA and China don’t have to trust each other or each other’s banks because they can trust Ethereum. While it may sound like a long shot, it does make sense if Ethereum hits a multi-trillion dollar market cap that it is the most secure and neutral way to transfer value between these adversaries. Not to mention if much of the world’s commerce were to be settled in the same place - on Ethereum - then it would make sense for governments to settle on the same platform.

ETH distribution is decentralised

Thanks to over 5 years of proof of work - a system where miners have to sell newly minted ETH to pay for electricity costs - newly mined ETH has found its way into the hands of everyday people who buy ETH off miners selling on exchnages. As pointed out by u/AdamSC1 in his analysis of the top 10K ETH addresses (I highly recommend reading this if you haven’t already), the distribution of ETH is actually slightly more decentralised than Bitcoin with the top 10,000 ETH wallets holding 56.70% of ETH supply compared to the top 10,000 Bitcoin wallets which hold 57.44% of the Bitcoin supply. This decentralised distribution means that the introduction of staking won’t centralise ETH in the hands of a few wallets who could then control the network. This is an advantage for ETH which many proof of stake ETH killers will never have as they never used PoW to distribute funds widely throughout the community and these ETH killers often did funding rounds giving large numbers of tokens to VC investors.

The community

Finally, while I may be biased, I think that Ethereum has the friendliest community. Anecdotally, I find that the Ethereum developer community is full of forward thinking people who want to make the world a better place and build a better future, many of whom are altruistic and don’t always act in their best interests. Compare this to the much more conservative, “at least we’re safe while the world burns” attitude which many Bitcoiners have. I don’t want to generalise too much here as the Bitcoin community is great too and there are some wonderful people there. But the difference is clear if you compare the daily discussion of Bitcoin to the incredibly helpful and welcoming daily discussion of EthFinance who will happily answer your noob questions without calling you an idiot and telling you to do you own research (there are plenty more examples in any of the daily threads). Or the very helpful folks over at EthStaker who will go out of their way to help you set up an ETH 2.0 staking node on the testnets (Shoutout to u/superphiz who does a lot of work over in that sub!). Don’t believe me? Head over to those subs and see for yourself.
Please don’t hate on me if you disagree about which project has the best community, it is just my very biased personal opinion and I respect your opinion if you disagree! :)

TL;DR:

ETH 2.0 - Huge scaling and better tokenomics.
EIP-1559 and ETH scarcity - ETH issuance will be super low and could go negative in the coming years.
Layer 2 Scaling - Literally dozens of different solutions/projects. Many of which are live on mainnet now.
DeFi and Composability - Money legos and open source code allowing for fast development and unprecedented innovation in the world of finance.
NFTs and tokenisation - Tokenise everything. No, seriously.
Institutional Adoption - Ethereum has the most enterprise partners (EEA) + the Baseline protocol is bullish AF.
Institutional Investment - Grayscale investments now owns 2% of ETH supply and growing. With institutional adoption comes awareness of the benefits of being an ETH holder and staker. ETH will complement the growing trend of companies holding Bitcoin.
The state of global markets - Crypto is just about the only asset class not at an ATH and the system Ethereum wants to replace is looking very broken.
Improving UX and abstracting away complexity - Human readable addresses and smart contract wallets which even your mother could use.
The lack of an obvious #1 ETH killer - No ETH killer clearly sticks out from the rest. This makes it hard for one of them to create a big network effect.
Network effects - Ethereum has by far the largest network effect and as Bitcoin has shown us, the network effect is extremely important.
Ethereum is the most decentralised and provably neutral smart contract platform - Super secure under ETH 2.0, no more tolerance of DAO like forks and a neutral platform for adversaries like the US and China to transact on so that they don’t have to trust each other’s banks.
ETH distribution is decentralised - Years of proof of work have put ETH in the hands of many. ETH supply is more decentralised than Bitcoin.
The community - Super duper mega friendly. Shoutout to the kind folks the EthFinance daily!

[REVIEW] Happy Holidays! 🎄CHANEL Classic Flap ( medium / SHW / caviar ) from Non-TS Kelly

[Table] I’m the founder and executive director of Love Not Lost, a nonprofit on a mission to revolutionize the way we heal in grief. I know we have all faced loss this year. Grief is hard. I’m here to create a space to talk about it so Ask Me ANYTHING! (pt 2/3)

Source | Previous table
Rows in table: ~90

Questions	Answers
We just lost my little brother to suicide less than a month ago. He was struggling to find happiness and was hurting after the end of a relationship, but we never expected him to take his life. He shot himself in the master bathroom of my parents' home. My mother is understandably traumatized, but she also is often asking the why and what-if questions. Whether she was a good mother, if she could have changed things, what she might have done differently that morning. Lots of questions that, frankly, we will probably never know the answer to. The issue is, these questions keep her in a state of mind that doesn't allow her to move forward. And she's trapped herself in a mindset which resulted in inpatient treatment for severe anxiety in the past worrying herself to death. How can I nudge her away from that place and those questions? How do I help her grieve in a way that helps her heal and begin to move forward?	This is definitely a scenario where I am going to beg you to get a therapist involved asap - preferably one who specializes in trauma. There are so many layers of grief and trauma you and your parents have been through. I can’t even begin to scratch the surface in a comment. A good therapist will be able to dive into your story, learn more about each of you, your history, your character, your communication styles, and more to help give you specific guidance through the days and months ahead. I am so sorry. My heart is broken for your family. My chest hurt reading this. One of my good friends lost her sibling to suicide earlier this year and it’s devastating.
	If you’re a reader, one of my favorite books on trauma is The Body Keeps The Score, which offers insight on healing from trauma. I truly am sending so much love to you and hope you can find the right support to help you and your mom with her anxiety and fear.
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My parents are speaking to counselors and participating in support groups, yes. I just wanted to know if there was anything I could do, personally, to help her accept that she's not to blame. Thank you.	I’m so glad to hear you have counseling support and hope that trauma support is a part of that. As far as personal support, I go with my gut and my heart for moments of support... Sometimes my heart will guide me to say something specific. Other times I will feel like I am supposed to stay quiet and just be present. I think a big part of support is being able to see the other person’s state of being and know how to best love them wherever they are.
	So much of support is loving - and so much of loving is knowing. Because I don’t know your mom, I don’t feel like I can really help with specifics. But maybe you can start by asking her, “how can I love you best right now?” That’s usually where I start...
My sister is in the final stages of bone cancer. She is in her 40s with young children. Our entire family is grieving and so is my sister. Her life will be cut short and all of it feels massively unfair. Do you have any suggestions on ways to help her as she attempts to cope with her grief? She doesn’t have much time left. I just want to be there for her in any way possible.	I am so sorry. Bone cancer is awful and facing your own death is incredibly challenging. I walked a friend through stage 4 lung cancer and he was in his 50s. One way that I helped him is that I would bring him anti-inflammatory foods and tea, I would sit with him alone in the house when he was resting just so he would have company or someone to call if he needed help, and I was also willing to ask him hard questions, like, “are you afraid to die?”
	We would sit and cry together. He had some religious questions but wasn’t able to get out of the house hardly, so I asked a pastor to come over and talk with him. I would make it known that he and his partner could call on me any time day or night and I would be there. I did my best to create a safe space for him to share anything he needed to share and just to let him know he was loved and not alone.
	I know you don’t have a lot of time left, but one thing you might want to look into is Saga to help your sister record some memories to preserve so your family can listen to them after she’s gone.
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My heart goes out to anyone with an ill loved one. My sweet father in law is sick with an incurable brain tumor. We can’t spend time with him during this time and we want the connection so much. I found Saga and it just brings me so much relief and happiness to hear my father in law’s stories recorded for his children and grandchildren. He is so happy to pick up the app and answer random and varied questions and hearing his voice makes me well up with tears of joy. I wish I had Saga when my grandparents passed away 10 years ago so my kids could have heard more about what life was like a long time ago.	Thank you so much for sharing ♥️
Have you thought of working with the Order of the Good Death?	Never heard of it - what is it all about?
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The Order of the Good Death is a death acceptance organization founded in 2011 by mortician and author Caitlin Doughty. The group advocates for natural burial and embracing human mortality. I think your goals would match up well. Death and Grief are linked and you probably have a perspective members would like to hear.	That’s awesome. Thank you! I will check it out. My husband and I chose a natural burial for our daughter.
	This is really awesome - I am on the Order of a Good Death website now and it reminds me so much of Caleb Wilde and his book Confessions of a Funeral Director. His website.
	Thank you so much for sharing this 🙏♥️
I know you’re likely off this ama, but I’m just very interested in the topic of grief. My question is: how can I make others understand that my anticipatory grief at the impending loss of my dog is a valid grief? In the U.S. anyway, bereavement leave from work is a sham that varies from place to place and state to state, but never seems to last longer than a week. And for pets or best friends, those losses aren’t considered under paid bereavement leave. But when my dog dies, I honestly can’t imagine functioning again for a very long time. However, it seems like others (or workplaces, at least) do not validate that loss as grief.	Still here! I’ve been touching base all day so thanks for your question - it’s a really important topic and grief policies are something we are working on as a part of our corporate care program. Bereavement leave on average is three paid days... which means that if I lost my daughter on a Monday, I would be expected back at work on Friday. THAT IS INSANE.
	As far as pets, I also agree that those losses are not taken seriously, even though many of us view our pets as family members. I had a dog from age 5 to 21 - she was like a sister growing up and helped me through my parents divorce. I was a mess when she died and I totally understand your concern.
	Have you had any conversations with your boss? Do you have any PTO time you can take if you don’t get bereavement leave?
Grief sucks. This is crazy i was just thinkign about grief. I miss my dad. I miss my grandma, she was like my mom because she literally was.. Its just so fucked up. Sometimes you wont have any emotion around the death of ur loved one, then itll hit you like a fucking plane. Im only 15 bruhbut these emotions are intense. MY grandpa i live with is coughing 24/7, hes sleeping more, and eating less, and his grammar is more poor. Hes already had multiple srtokes. My dad overdosed and died earlier this year on july. My grandma died when i was 10. I mean seomtimes I just stop giving a fuck and look up to god and try and just let him control because last time I did he didnt do me wrong... but.. Its just missing the feeling you had when you were with that person.. Missing the way you used to view the world when they were still alive.. Missing the way you used to think, operate, and how different things were when they were alive. Then you consider that they if they were depresesd as fuck, or if they were ur parent, they prolly went through what you went through when they were your age, which just makes it worse. But the hardest part? Accepting thtat they arent coming back... Coping with that god awful "empty" feeling of pain in your chest.... Because they really arent coming back.. You cant hug them, talk to them, ask for advice, create/ new memories, and thinking about old memories becomes hard because of the emotion it brings, especially if you have some sort of mental issues such as depression or bipolar or stuff around that spectrum.. I just think in my head... Is heaven real? I think it is personally but if it is... IS my grandma talking to her son (my dad) up there? ITs so sad. I hope that my dad can rejoice and get the happiness he never could, and talk to my grandma... I really do hope so. I just want him to hvae a conversation with my grandma, bceause Im sure that he missed his mom more than anything while he was still alive. Its the shit like this that creates a drug dealegang-bangeprisoneserial killer. Im just worried for my future... Im alreaedy failing high shcool... Fuck dude.. Why am I dealing with these emotions at this age. .Why? Why am i put through this. I really love the lord jesus christ. I love him. I would die for him if he vividily and as clear as he ever could told me that I had to die to prove I love him. Please. Every christian, and catholic here, pray for my grandpa. Please. Yall can already imagine how I feel. How... Just how do I accept my dads death.. It just aint fucking right. Its not. NOt one fuckin bit.	To be 15 and going through what you are going through, I have mad respect for you that you’re here and wanting to heal. I’m sorry for the many losses you’ve experienced in such a short time. Your words “coping with that golf awful ‘empty’ feeling in your chest” resonate with me - that feeling is so real! Do any of your teachers know what you’ve gone through or what you’re currently dealing with at home? I lost my aunt, who I was extremely close with, while I was in college. In my personal experience, any time I would go to a teacher I trusted to share my struggles, they were understanding and cut me some slack - some even offered to help with resources or connections. I believe most teachers are good humans with big hearts - they’re certainly not there for the money.
	Your school might also have a counselor on site that you can talk to for free if that interests you... If not, they might be able to help you find someone.
	As far as your belief in Jesus, I asked some similar questions when my 21 months old daughter died in my arms at the age of 27. I don’t know if this will help in any way, but some answers that I landed on is that Jesus’ life was full of suffering. A Christian isn’t promised an easy life full of happiness, in fact, it’s almost the opposite. And it was actually in the suffering (as my daughter’s illness progressed and she became closer to death) that I felt closest to God. That didn’t make it any easier - it still sucked and was the worst pain I’ve ever felt. And I do find comfort that my daughter is with my aunts, grandparents, and other relatives on the other side. I also believe that they can still love us from the other side.
	I’m happy to share more if you want to hear it or stay connected outside of this Reddit if you want to talk more. Your future isn’t doomed and you’re not alone. There is hope and I am happy to help you as much as I can.
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first&foremost DM me so I can keep contact. But its just kinda hard knowing that if they are up there (i beleive that they are tho) and watching over me, they saw all the gross stuff ive done, eman stuff, illegal stuff, and etc... I mean I hang with gang members, if i was caught i couldve been a felon more tiems I can count, im failing in life... They aint proud. I want to have the strength to have the will to do schoolwork, i rly do. You ever think about them wtaching over u doing all ur stuff they wouldnt be proud of, and then kidna.. cringe to say the least	Sent a DM 👍
I have dealt with a lot of guilt in feeling grief. When my biological father died, I felt guilty for grieving because we weren't super close throughout my life (though I was with him when he passed). My oldest sister (his daughter from a previous marriage) just died on December 4th and I have been grieving so much for her even though we never met in person...and because of this I feel incredibly guilty and like I don't deserve to grieve. What would you suggest to help people with that feeling of guilt to be able to allow themselves that needed period of grief?	I first want to acknowledge that you experienced a loss and your grief is valid in both scenarios. You absolutely deserve to grieve and if you’re body is grieving, it’s working with you to feel those feeling and heal.
	Do you feel guilty because of judgement coming from within or because of judgement from others? Regardless, it’s important to realize that not all voices you hear are voices you should listen to.
	Listen to your body, give yourself permission to feel without judgement, and let yourself grieve ♥️
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I'm feeling the judgment from within. Everyone I'm close to has kind of just forgotten about it I guess (especially my sister's death) because I've only grieved in private and have thrown myself into being busy and working hard to keep it at bay. Thank you for your sentiments and advice. ❤️	You’re welcome. And you may not be alone. A lot of people grieve in private because they think it’s not acceptable to talk about. So you may think others have moved on, when in reality they may actually be processing still in private too...
I lost my grandmother 6 months ago. My father blames himself that he couldn't do much to save her. How do I help my dad through this guilt?	Oh man, my heart hurts for you and your dad. It’s so hard when people blame themselves. I would consult a counselor or therapist for support. They’ll be able to get more of a backstory, understand who your dad is and how he communicates, learn who you are and how you communicate, and guide you through the process of those interactions. A good therapist can be such a treasure in the healing journey.
	If you don’t have the funds, the most important thing for anyone is to feel unconditionally loved. From my personal experience, it can be helpful to hear that you don’t blame him for her death, that you love him and know he did everything he could in each moment he had.
	It is easy to look back and say, “I should’ve done more...” or “I could’ve done this and that would’ve made the difference...” but looking at the past is so easy to judge and think differently. I believe in each moment in the present, we are doing the best we can with the tools and information we have.
	Again, a counselor could guide you on what to say specifically and the proper timing to best work with your dad to encourage helpful and healing conversations.
What would be your ideas to help with grief that came after a breakdown in the relationship? I completely relate to your founding story, in regards to not being able to find the tools in facilitating healing. We had a stillborn death 3 months after discovering my wife had an affair the year previous. We have had a very different journey to healing, and whilst communication has been there, it hasn't always been led in to effective action to meet our needs. More specifically, I've found it difficult to be there as her support and I've wanted to grieve more privately. This has been exacerbated by the pandemic and breakdown in trust.	I’m so sorry - the loss of a baby at birth is so much more than the loss of life. And that can be extra hard if the trust with your partner is on the rocks. My husband and I grieved very differently. He wanted the alone time (introvert). I wanted to talk about it (verbal processor and social person). I honestly considered divorce but thankfully I could take a step back and see that it was just our grief going in two different directions and not necessarily our marriage. We didn’t have any trust issues but we weren’t the best at our communication. We struggled so hard for a couple of years and it was rough, but we fought through it.
	I had a friend lose two sons and her and her husband ended up getting divorced. They had some trust issues and that is the route they chose to move forward with.
	Your situation is unique to the two of you and your willingness to fight together (be on the same team) or fight against each other. There are so many complex layers to relationships - family influence, past trauma, unresolved hurts within the existing relationship, grief, etc. I honestly think counseling is one of the best ways forward.
	Our counselor sat us down and asked us what our vision for our marriage was... where did we see ourselves in 10 years. Honestly, I was exhausted and rather hopeless at that point. I didn’t have much to say, but my husband jumped in. He painted this really beautiful vision for our marriage that had me in tears. I had no idea that was what he was hoping for in the future and I was all for it.
	Having that common vision helped me through the tough times. When I wanted to scream and give up, I held onto that vision and reminded myself that’s what we are both working towards. We are Team Jones and we’re going to make it.
	Funny thing is I brought up the vision to my husband a year later and he forgot what he said, haha. But it didn’t matter because I knew what he said was true of his heart and it got me through the times I needed it to.
	I know that doesn’t directly answer your question outside of getting a counselor, but I hope that helps!
Hi and thank you for this. Most people’s concept of grief is based on media, and how “you’ll get over it and move on.” Or “cmon- it’s been a year. It’s time to move on” Something I’ve learned after losing my father at age 17 (almost 20 years ago) is that the concept of loss, and grief, is forever. You’ll always miss that person. You’ll always have a hole in your heart for them. An absolutely amazing tool in my healing was an HBO documentary called “Dead Mothers Club”. It’s about all these powerful women in media and Hollywood and how they all lost their mothers at a young age. I learned that if someone like Jane Fonda can live her life with every resource and surround herself with the best people, and she still grieves and mourns 60 years later... maybe that’s normal. Maybe I shouldn’t be ashamed of my grief. As for a question, how do you feel we can normalize mourning and grief in our culture, and not have it be something to hide away or feel ashamed of?	Thanks for sharing your story. I think the more we can make it public, the better - like the documentary you watched. When people realize loss is something everyone goes through, isn’t something to be ashamed of, and grief is to be expected when experiencing loss, it can “normalize” it on a societal level and create more openness and vulnerability in sharing on a personal level.
	Honestly, it’s a big reason I do AMAs. I did one several years ago on this sub reddit and did one on the smaller AMA two weeks ago. It’s also a big motivation on applying to speak at TEDx. I try to book as many speaking gigs, podcast interviews, magazine features as my schedule will allow so that we can open up more conversations and invite as many people to join in as possible. The media plays a critical role and I hope more and more outlets and publications will help break the stigma around grief and loss. The more we talk about it and hear other people’s stories, the less scary it will be.
	If anyone reading this has connections, please help us open up more conversations!
Thank you for doing this AMA and for sharing your experiences with people, it means a lot as I know I struggle to do so. I lost my grandfather to a severe infection last year after a 4-year battle with dementia and I have found myself more relieved than anything else, especially since his cognitive ability was declining rapidly and the isolation and worry of Covid-19 would have been a horrible thing for him to live through. I did find myself wishing that his suffering would be short-lived in the run up to his death, so I feel like I almost wanted him dead as he was inconvenient and got my wish. He was more like a father to me (I called him dad) and he was my oldest friend, so these memories cause me to feel very guilty. I know the relief is normal, along with the guilt and the irrational application of feelings, but it is hard to deal with. Do you think the guilt will ever go away?	Thank you for sharing. Your desires for a short suffering are “normal” as is the relief. I felt the same for my daughter watching her body fail her and felt relief that she died quickly. That doesn’t mean we actually want them gone and I think that can be easily mixed up in our heads. Clearly you loved him and wouldn’t wish him gone for no reason. It was your love that wanted his suffering to end and that’s nothing to feel guilty or shame about. It’s important to remind yourself that and shut the lies up in your head.
	Not all voices in our heads (or in the world for that matter) are good to listen to. We have to be selective because what we listen to shapes our beliefs. You’re not a bad person. You loved your grandpa and he loves you back, even now.
	I know your guilt can go away and hope you can release it, even if a counselor needs to help you. Sending you so much love this holiday season ♥️
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Thanks for replying Ashley, your kind words and understanding mean a lot. I am seeing a counsellor but it is sometimes easier to write things down than say them - I think I'll bring this up with her at my next session. Sending my love your way this holiday season too.	You’re welcome ♥️ and thank you!
I have lost loved ones suddenly and I found the thing that heals this loss is time. As time passes the sadness lessens and the joy of cherished memories takes it's place. You can't speed this up or mask it with something. Don't you think the passage of time is the best way to heal?	I think time + intention + presence = healing Time allows us the space to heal, but if we are avoiding the pain and checking out every day, the healing won’t just happen. It takes intention and a willingness to be present in all of the emotions to listen, feel, grieve, and heal.
	That’s my own personal belief.
Why do you intend to get this culture of compassion past the institutional treason of capitalism? I’m all for anything that would work on a collective organizational level.	The why is because people are suffering at work and I believe we can do something about it. I was serving a family - the mom was caring for the dad who was on hospice, and they had twin girls. She told me she was let go and didn’t know how she would pay the mortgage as she was the bread winner. Her job also carried the health insurance. Her husband died weeks later.
	That was it for me. I wanted to stand in front of every leader and tell them what it’s like to be a full time employee while also being a full time caregiver and the sole provider for a family. I wanted to take her story and show how heartless her bosses were as the example of what not to do.
	I also would hear from different executives that they wanted to help employees who had lost loved ones or even team members who had died but didn’t know what to do.
	So we are here to help.
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Well Satan bless you, I hope you succeed beyond your wildest dreams. But this just sounds like yet another individualistic response to a systemic problem. Abolishing capitalism is how you fix this, not convincing corporations to be more compassionate. It’s kind of like trying to convince individual nazis that they’re bad. You can only get so far. Good luck!	I appreciate the comment and respectfully disagree. We are going to be working with executives to change the culture and support leadership in making those changes, which will impact everyone in the company to some degree and have ripple effects into future generations.
	I may not fully understand the beast of capitalism, but I do understand healing and the power of love.
	I’ve met several corporations that have incredible leaders and cultures already that show me it’s possible for both to exist. Tillamook is one of the companies that are leading the way with empathy and a culture of caring.
Do you have any suggestions on dealing with the sadness that comes along with memories of lost loved ones? My mom passed away on my 22nd birthday 2 years ago. She was the only close family I had. Now it's hard to celebrate my birthday without that grief creeping up. Her birthday was on Christmas Eve too, which also make the holidays tough. I loved my mom endlessly, and still do. But I'm 24 and I don't want to spend all these moments that should be filled with joy crying. Are there also any affordable services that deal with grief that you could recommend? I'm a college student with very unstable finances. I have yet to talk to a professional about what has happened, but would very much like to.	First, I am so sorry. Having those dates fall on celebratory occasions can be extra challenging. Have you looked into what your school provides? Some colleges have programs or counseling offerings that are free for students. I would definitely start there. I’m glad you’re open to talking to a professional and hope you find someone who you work well with as you process everything.
	There are also free mindfulness and meditation practices that you could cultivate (a simple google search on grief meditations will pull up a bunch - they’re not all good, but you can sort through them). I’m not sure if you’re a reader or like to listen to podcasts, but that’s an option too. Check out our library page that has some podcasts listed as well as some books if that’s your thing as a place to start.
	I would also encourage you to think of ways to flip the script. Instead of thinking of it as a day to be miserable and sad, is there a way you could honor your mom instead? For example, if she loved flowers, you could plant a flowering plant somewhere every year to remember her and spread joy to everyone who sees it. Did she do anything for you on birthdays past that you would want to repeat in her memory? What would you gift her on her birthday and could you find a single person in a nursing home or someone living by themselves to give something to in honor of her?
	For my daughter’s birthday, I was miserable for the first 4 years after she died. I literally spent the first birthday without her in her empty bed eating brownies - it was bad. Each year was different -some worse than others. But on what would’ve been her 6th birthday, I launched Love Not Lost. I invited 30 of our closest friends and family members to share my vision with and asked them to help me raise $6,000 in honor of her 6th birthday. Everyone came together to help me meet the goal and we launched our website and promo video as a result.
	I hope that helps. My heart is with you!
Any tips on recovering from suicide grief? I’ve lost loved ones naturally before, but my beloved cousin’s suicide was over 3 years ago, and I’m still stuck in my grief with no end in sight. This grief is so utterly different than grief I had experienced prior, and I just can’t find my “acceptance”.	I think my questions would be - how is it different for you? What has you stuck? Why is that? I made a comment earlier today about the 5 stages of grief and how they shouldn’t be applied to grief in general. Please don’t hold yourself to the 5 stages because they are specifically designed for people facing their own death. Grief in losing a loved one is complex, messy, and it doesn’t end. It doesn’t always have to be painful, but just as your love for someone doesn’t go away, your grief won’t either.
after having a lengthy conversation with a friend about how most non profit organizations do actually make money (paying board of directors and people like you) can you give some insight on this? After really just discovering this I feel a little weird considering how much money some nonprofits make. But all in all, every single one does help people so I dont have a major issue other than the misleading direction that the name Non profit has become associated with. Thank you so much for what you do!	Yes - so there is a huge misconception that nonprofits should operate on zero costs, which some have the capability to do that with volunteers and connections. However, most nonprofits are set up to operate like a business - but instead of “profits” going to shareholders and individuals, it is held by the nonprofit and invested in future projects, staff, etc. We actually don’t pay our board members a penny. They are a volunteer board and actually give money to Love Not Lost to help us grow. We have two full times staff members (myself being one of them) and desperately need more to reach the capacity we want to hit, but we’re working on fundraising for that in 2021.
	Just like any industry, there are good ones and there are bad ones. The lack of transparency in the nonprofit industry of the history of its existence has been a huge disappointment. Love Not Lost is 5 years old and we’ve talked with so many people who have trust issues with nonprofits in general and we get it. We’ve worked hard to earn trust from our community and show our impact and stewardship.
	Education is so important and we’re grateful for people like Dan Pallotta - check out his TED talk here.. He’s written books and facilitated workshops that are pretty fantastic to encourage more entrepreneurial thinking and have more efficiency in operations. You might find his stuff interesting.
	Thanks for the question and for joining the conversation. Happy holidays!
Do you have any tips on how to function with anticipatory grief? My Mom was very unexpectedly diagnosed with stage iv cancer about a month ago. While I will not give up hope that she can overcome or live a long time with this disease, I still feel like I am in the midst of grief. I am grieving the loss of her role in my life, grieving her health, and grieving the ideas I had for my future with her.	Hey - just curious, would you be willing to share what state you’re in? Functioning with anticipatory grief is definitely a challenge, and if you’re able, I would highly recommend a counselor that you can confide in throughout the journey. They’ll be able to guide you through the day to day challenges that will arise and support you through specific stressors that are hard to give general advice for...
	From my own personal experience with my daughter’s illness and death, it’s hard. My heart is with you on this one. It was such a struggle not to let fear of death and the future rob me of the joy and life in the present. It helped me to set intentions to choose love each day, to breathe into the present moment every time I got anxious, and remind myself of all of the things I still had.
	Writing really helped me. I kept a weekly blog - sometimes daily - throughout my journey on blogspot (lol, that sounds so dated - it was 10 years ago). Grief broke me wide open and allowed me to expand so much as an individual.
	I hope you can find what helps you. It’s a tough road ahead, but one that is so rich too.
My fiance lost his brother suddenly 2 months ago. They didn’t have a great relationship however were mending fences and trying to reconnect. Unfortunately the brother’s time ran out due to an overdose. The sudden death and loss has left him with not only guilt, questions, and sadness but also crippling anxiety. He never had anxiety before but now he gets triggered randomly and finds himself unable to breath, think rationally, and function almost daily. Do you have any insight on why he suddenly suffers from anxiety attacks? Or perhaps what I can do as his partner? Also, we planned on getting married in July however I’m worried it may be too soon. He insists he’ll be fine by then but I’m scared wedding stress might make him have an anxiety attack on the day of. I keep telling him we should postpone another year but he doesn’t agree. I desperately want to give him all the time he needs to grieve and allow the anxiety to go away however he seems to be opposed.	I am so sorry - is he open to going to counseling? Or does he already have a good therapist? Have you seen a therapist together? It sounds like there are a lot of layers there. I’m not sure I can be extremely helpful, but I know a good therapist would be able to dive into this with you and help him with his anxiety and possibly help guide you as a couple (and help him think rationally about his anxiety, wedding pressures, etc.). Is that something you can afford or would consider?
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Thanks for replying! He will begin receiving medical insurance from his job in January so he plans on seeking help then when it is covered. We were in Mexico earlier this week and he went to see a therapist since it’s cheap out there. It was only one session however he shared with me that he found it helpful. Apparently the therapist dived into why he’s feeling anxiety and together they identified alcohol as a trigger. For context, the day before we had visited a vineyard and did a tasting. Later that night he got anxiety while walking around the beach. Anyways Since the session my fiancé has decided to stop drinking for some time to see if it helps stop the anxiety.	That’s awesome. I hope the anxiety solution is as simple as stop drinking. I am pretty sensitive to caffeine and don’t drink coffee or soda often because it can cause increased anxiety for me.
	If he’s open to it, I think a couples counselor would be incredibly helpful if you can find a good one. You have so many big life changes/decisions coming up and it can be hard to navigate those even in the best of circumstances. Regardless, I am rooting for you and hope you are able to communicate safely with one another and build trust through the process.
how would this work for losing an early term pregnancy? You don't get pictures of the baby. Not to mention society as a whole does not recognize or acknowledge that type of loss	I agree that society doesn’t do a good job in recognizing early pregnancy loss, and I hope that’s changing as more people (celebrities included) are sharing their miscarriage stories. We will continue working to normalize loss and grief of all kinds so that support is always available to those who need it.
	Our goal at Love Not Lost with our portrait sessions is to celebrate life and preserve memories of love. If there is enough time with an early term pregnancy loss, we would offer a maternity session. We’ve done this for several families - middle to late term - who knew they were going to lose their baby.
	We had a mom share that the photos bring her so much joy now because she was able to feel the baby move during the session and those photos bring her back to those moments. We’ve had another mom share the photos validated her as a mother as she sat in an empty nursery on Mother’s Day.
	I hope that answers your question about how it works - I made the assumption you were talking about the photo sessions since you mentioned pictures. Feel free to ask a follow up if I missed anything!
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well that would not help me as my losses were at 5 and 8 weeks out of nowhere and I was of course not showing yet. You might want to think about a way to do something for those people like me. Some of those women don't even have an ultrasound pic at that point. You seemed to think having a picture helped but I was pointing out a situation of grief and loss where they are no pictures. So what the heck would someone like me do?	Do you have any suggestions? We would totally be open to hearing ideas!
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No, not really. But that grief is just as real and serious and they often go completely ignored. I know I was.	I completely agree with you and am sorry that was your experience. If anything comes to you, reach out any time.
I’m a high school teacher whose students must work from home. How can I help them deal with this stress?	I hope other teachers comment on things they’ve done or ideas they’ve seen others use... I can share some ideas, but again, I would love to hear from other teachers on this!
	I have several teacher friends and one thing that has made a tremendous impact in one of the classes is the teacher starts every day with a check in. Every student gets to speak and share how they are doing. Sometimes it’s a “one a scale of 1-10, how are you feeling today” with short answers and other days it’s a longer prompt that encourages students to share more.
	I think it’s really powerful when a teacher can create a safe space (making rules and culture standards if needed) for students to share their feelings and allow them to feel seen and heard.
How easy is it to lecture on a Tedx talk? I’ve seen some real stinkers and have heard that there is very little vetting process taking place.	Each TEDx is independently operated so I believe that each one is unique and different based on the organizers and volunteers.
	With that said, I was under the impression that more would be offered by TED as a whole and they are pretty much removed from it.

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